The Crisis Tapes Talkback - Episode 11: Crisis on Infinite Earths #1, Part 2
Adam_Murdough
Posts: 506
Faster than a speeding shadow-demon, Peter and Adam return with their thoughts and observations concerning the second half of Crisis #1. Thrill to the summoning of the Monitor's first team of champions from two-or-so Earths--then sit back and enjoy your hosts' 'draft analysis'! (3:00:51)
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I also wanted to give a response to the question Derick asked about which writer/artist Dick Giordano asked to work on what would ultimately become Crisis, because I remember hearing about this years ago and was intrigued by the possibilities of what may have been if this developed in another way. The following is a post from John Byrne's website FAQ page...
Was JB once asked to write CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS?
I have read that JB was asked to do the original 80s CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS miniseries. Is this true?
Some time in the early 1980s -- I can't pinpoint the exact date, but I do recall that I was attending a convention in Atlanta -- DC's then-EiC Dick Giordano approached me about writing and drawing something that had the working title "The History of the DC Universe". This was proposed as a 12 issue "maxi-series" which would use the first 11 issues to lay out all the established DC lore, doing the best that could be done to shuffle all the conflicting details into some kind of cohesive whole, Then, in the 12th issue, everything would "blow up" due to some terrible cosmic catastrophe, and the next month all the DC books would "restart" with first issues.
As it happened, I was having dinner with Dick, Frank Miller and Frank's then-girlfriend Laurie Sutton, when Dick made the offer, and Frank was quick to say I would have to be crazy to accept such a project. I agreed -- but in any case, acceptance was unlikely since, as I told Dick, my knowledge of the history of the DCU was not as extensive as of the Marvel Universe. There were, in fact, huge tracts of DC lore (such as the Legion of Superheroes) about which I knew almost nothing.
So I passed on the project, and over the next couple of years it floated around, mutating as it went, until it became CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS. (12/28/2004)
Both Perez and Wolfman are on Twitter. Send them a link guys. I think they'd be flattered at your efforts.
The answer to the first (writer/artist) is John Byrne. If you check around his forum, he mentions the story every so often. (I'd ask him about it, but I am not allowed to post there anymore.)
The answer to the question regarding the original artist is Gil Kane. Before Crisis got its name (it may have been called DC Universe: Crisis at the time), Gil Kane was announced. It was done in the context that he would be drawing DC Comics 50th anniversary event. Not sure why he was dropped for George Perez. I can't recall if it was announce, in print, in Dick Giordano's Meanwhile . . . column or in a fanzine like Amazing Heroes.
This is from Saga of the Swamp Thing #10 cover dated Feb 83 which would have been on the stands in "late '82":
Writers are Marv Wolfman and Len Wein, the researcher Peter Sanderson is mentionned but no artists?
Then in SOST #25 cover dated June '84 we have this column:
Bob Greenberger gets a mention but no creator team.
Complete speculation on my part but I wonder if the mention of Gil Kane in the above paragraph about the Sword of the Atom series, and the lack of creators in the bottom paragraph may gave led to the rumour?? I can find no mentions in the Meanwhile columns between the above two dates.
Have they ever offered them at 99 cents in the past? Or will they ever?
I remember thinking that it was odd that DC would have announced Gil Kane when George Perez was drawing at least New Teen Titans at the time and was clearly, with John Byrne, the industries hottest artist (Walt Simonson hadn't exploded with Thor and Frank Miller wasn't the type of artist to draw such a big crossover.)
If anyone else can help - please do!! I'd love to find out where I read it.
The inclusion of Anthro (first boy) is interesting in light of Kamandi's (last boy) appearance a few pages later. What's more intriguing to me now is how such a rather obscure character like Anthro is given the spotlight. I liked how the series consistently gave these lesser characters nice moments to highlight the breadth of the DCU. I wish that DC and Marvel were able to expand their sales to include more superhero characters like cavemen, cowboys, & Atlantean wizards.
Younger CGS listeners may have no knowledge of the Flash's trial that's mentioned. I never read this long story by Cary Bates but I do recall people talking about how interminable it was at the time. I always thought that some fans were ready for Wally to pick up the mantle after the negative reaction to that storyline. I read an interview with Bates online where he discussed that he was told about a year before Crisis that Barry would be killed off. He also said that if the Crisis hadn't come, Barry would like have become a fugitive from justice and eventually joined his own rogues gallery. (http://speedforce.org/2011/05/interview-cary-bates2/)
The Batman/Joker scene (though brief) was always one of my favorite moments in the series. It nicely encapsulates their relationship over the decades. More importantly, they each display a sense of fear and panic that's not often evident in their characterizations.
As I re-read the series, I'm struck by how much I preferred the superheroes in the pre-grim and gritty era sparked by Watchmen and Dark Knight Returns.
Does anyone know what the "fight" with Dr. Canus was that Kamandi refers to?
Overall, I am a fan of Crisis and what it accomplished at the time. However, in retrospect I believe Wolfman's plan to streamline the DCU was doomed to fail. Yes, the Superman mythos (for example) may have been overstuffed but I did quickly come to miss all that had been swept away. For more than a decade DC tried to unsuccsesfully revamp Supergirl when many readers wanted Kara Zor-El back. It seems that eventually everyone who died came back.
Who doesn't want a DCU where a superdog named Krypto wears a cape?
FYI: There is a Crisis entry in the newly published encyclopedia "Comics Through Time" (vol. 3).
http://www.comicbookdb.com/character.php?ID=4097
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dawnstar
The "DC Guide" gives James Sherman the design credit
http://www.dcuguide.com/who.php?name=dawnstar
Apparently, James Sherman did do the interior pencils on Superboy 226, but Grell did the cover, so....(???) So, I'm a bit confused, but why would both Wikipedia and Comic DB and a few other sites including Comic Vine, say that Grell is the co-creator, not Sherman?
Sherman may have penciled her first story before Grell drew the cover for that issue, I'm not sure. But he worked off of Grell's drawing either way. Some people assume that since Sherman drew the first story, he must have co-created her, but that's not the case, according to Paul.
http://maurice.bgsu.edu/record=b2814824~S9
Holy crap! I didn't realize it was accessible.
http://www.bgsu.edu/library/pcl.html
It was mentioned via email or a posting about people reminiscing about the series when it first came out. I remember reading that first issue, January of 1985, right? My Dad had to drive on in to San Francisco and I tagged along and somehow talked him in to stopping beforehand so I could buy some comics (not sure which store though). So while my Dad did his business, I clearly remember being parked in the station wagon around the piers of SF reading the first issue while Tears for Fear's "Shout" played on the radio. So 1985!!! :)