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Valiant Talk

Stemming from recent semi-on-topic from April Solicits with @luke52 and @bralinator :

Overall, I've been digging the new Valiant stuff, though there are weak parts.

Unfortunately, I feel like Archer and Armstrong, which was an early favorite, have been diminished since they teamed up with Quantum and Woody.

Ninjak, OTOH, has been pretty freaking solid all the way through, though I'm not terribly impressed with the design of the Shadow Seven and have been less than impressed with the coloring on the Swords of Master Darque arc.

Ultimately, I really like their slower growth - limited number of titles, more short arcs to flesh out parts of the universe and see what sticks. Good stuff.

Probably as much of a reflection of my taste (I seem to spend more time reading grimdark) as anything, but the only thing that really hurts the Valiant Universe for me is the more absurdist elements A+A and Q&W, I'm looking at you specifically.

Comments

  • luke52luke52 Posts: 1,392
    Got to agree with you @hauberk A&A and Q&W aren't my favourite at the moment too. I really enjoyed The Delinquents arc from a few years back, but been a bit average lately.

    Equally Faith has been a little trying lately. Glad they're giving her a rest.

    Onto the good stuff... really enjoying the mini series they're putting out. Savage, Britannia and the Divinity arcs have all been really strong. The Prestige formats are really nice too. Real bang for your $3.99.

    The long going Bloodshot and Ninjak series from Jeff Lemire and Matt Kindt respectively are my favourite though. Two great creators just being allowed to do as they please... and doing it well. Loving the covers on that new Master Darque arc in Ninjak too.

    Love the guys upstairs at Valiant too, they really seem to get themselves out there and big up their properties. Along with things like the Humble Bundle deals, they're doing all the right things to bring in new readers and keep existing readers happy. Great publishers.
  • bralinatorbralinator Posts: 5,967
    Great thread suggestion.

    For me, I'm still digging Bloodshot the most - and anything related to Rai/4001 A.D.. I also like the new X-O Manowar relaunch (so far), and recent limited series titles like Britannia and Divinity (1 & 2).

    To what do you guys attribute the fact that Valiant remains such a small, indie title though? I remember back in the 90's, they seemed to be booming. Then that delay-riddled crossover with Image and the foil-covered Turok Dinosaur Hunter over-prints seems to be around the time they lost their way which was also preceded by the moment Jim Shooter was forced out. I'm not convinced they've ever attained those heights, in spite of several attempts to rise again. Any thoughts on that? And maybe what they could do to boost their visibility?

  • luke52luke52 Posts: 1,392
    Valiant are beginning to really push their properties into TV and Movies. With Ninjak vs The Valiant Universe coming soon. Then the Bloodshot, Harbinger and Harbinger Wars movies in the next few years. And I heard that they're also pushing a A&A and Quantum and Woody show and movie (I forget which way round).
    I'm hoping this big screen presence will translate to comic sales.
  • hauberkhauberk Posts: 1,511

    Great thread suggestion.

    For me, I'm still digging Bloodshot the most - and anything related to Rai/4001 A.D.. I also like the new X-O Manowar relaunch (so far), and recent limited series titles like Britannia and Divinity (1 & 2).

    To what do you guys attribute the fact that Valiant remains such a small, indie title though? I remember back in the 90's, they seemed to be booming. Then that delay-riddled crossover with Image and the foil-covered Turok Dinosaur Hunter over-prints seems to be around the time they lost their way which was also preceded by the moment Jim Shooter was forced out. I'm not convinced they've ever attained those heights, in spite of several attempts to rise again. Any thoughts on that? And maybe what they could do to boost their visibility?

    Mixed thoughts on this one:

    1 - They learned their lesson from the original Valiant, which grew too large too fast.

    2 - I'd imagine that there's still a fair amount of skepticism from people that remember, and were burnt by, the later days of Valiant and then Acclaim.

    As far as Shooter goes, really,much of their best stuff happened under his watch. I'm not sure if he was just too desperate at the end of his tenure or if they just fell victim to the whole 90's over-the-top mentality sooner than other publishers. Unfortunately, I see a certain amount of that gimmicky stuff going on with VEI as well. Not a real big fan of what they did last year with the Book of the Geomancer and not terribly thrilled with their coupon campaign that just wrapped up in Harbinger Renegades for a Harbinger Wars II #0.
  • hauberkhauberk Posts: 1,511
    luke52 said:

    Got to agree with you @hauberk A&A and Q&W aren't my favourite at the moment too. I really enjoyed The Delinquents arc from a few years back, but been a bit average lately.

    Equally Faith has been a little trying lately. Glad they're giving her a rest.

    Onto the good stuff... really enjoying the mini series they're putting out. Savage, Britannia and the Divinity arcs have all been really strong. The Prestige formats are really nice too. Real bang for your $3.99.

    The long going Bloodshot and Ninjak series from Jeff Lemire and Matt Kindt respectively are my favourite though. Two great creators just being allowed to do as they please... and doing it well. Loving the covers on that new Master Darque arc in Ninjak too.

    Love the guys upstairs at Valiant too, they really seem to get themselves out there and big up their properties. Along with things like the Humble Bundle deals, they're doing all the right things to bring in new readers and keep existing readers happy. Great publishers.

    Really liked the Divinity books and Britannia. Both did a really nice job expanding the Valiant world and history. Also completely agree on Bloodshot and Ninjak (barring my complaints about the second issue of the Seven Swords arc (really, really didn't like the shiny blood and double perforated lungs is going to be tough to come back from)).

    Hot and cold on Savage. It was an interesting enough story, but I was pretty disappointed with how the first series ended. Definitely not what I would consider a self-contained story.
  • luke52luke52 Posts: 1,392
    Yeah agree with you about the coupon deal @hauberk especially as it was a US exclusive, so I had to miss out!
  • bralinatorbralinator Posts: 5,967
    I agree with everything you state, @hauberk. Your criticisms as to why Valiants current fan base is sometimes dissatisfied is spot on, but I guess what I'm saying is, what is Valiant not doing that it should be doing to bring in NEW readership and growing their base? Maybe @luke52 is onto something with his anticipation of the film's and television properties?
  • luke52luke52 Posts: 1,392

    I agree with everything you state, @hauberk. Your criticisms as to why Valiants current fan base is sometimes dissatisfied is spot on, but I guess what I'm saying is, what is Valiant not doing that it should be doing to bring in NEW readership and growing their base? Maybe @luke52 is onto something with his anticipation of the film's and television properties?

    A lot of fans I think may be set in their ways a bit too. They want their superhero books from the big 2. With money the way it is today maybe people aren't willing to fork out the extra to try something new when they're just as happy to keep getting their Spider-Man or Batman or whoever it may be.
  • hauberkhauberk Posts: 1,511

    I agree with everything you state, @hauberk. Your criticisms as to why Valiants current fan base is sometimes dissatisfied is spot on, but I guess what I'm saying is, what is Valiant not doing that it should be doing to bring in NEW readership and growing their base? Maybe @luke52 is onto something with his anticipation of the film's and television properties?

    I don't have an answer for that. I have to assume that they are attracting some new readers. Certainly, we're hearing some CGSers like @Adam_Murdough talking about reading some Valiant.

    I'd say that part of the challenge, as @luke52 suggested is that people are getting their superhero fixes elsewhere. The other consideration is that their limiting themselves to 8 titles makes them very accessible if you want to read everything, but less so if you're really interested in something like Imperium or one of the other titles that has ended in favor of throwing more stuff at the walls to see what might stick.

    I will say that I really do miss the presence of the GoldKey characters. Divinity is a pretty acceptable analog for Solar, but I'm not at all sure about Savage as Turok and Magnus feels pretty irreplaceable (had a bunch of old Magnus books from my uncles as a kid).
  • ChrisMurrinChrisMurrin Posts: 256
    I was all-in on the new Valiant at the start. Over time, though, Harbinger ended, Bloodshot ended, Archer & Armstrong ended, and X-O got mired in a crossover that wasn't to my tastes. All of which essentially pushed me out.

    I tried almost all of the relaunches, but nothing caught my interest the way those first relaunched titles did, though I did stick with A&A for at least an arc or two.

    At this point I'm trying the new X-O again, but that's about all the Valiant I'm reading these days.
  • hauberkhauberk Posts: 1,511

    I was all-in on the new Valiant at the start. Over time, though, Harbinger ended, Bloodshot ended, Archer & Armstrong ended, and X-O got mired in a crossover that wasn't to my tastes. All of which essentially pushed me out.

    I tried almost all of the relaunches, but nothing caught my interest the way those first relaunched titles did, though I did stick with A&A for at least an arc or two.

    At this point I'm trying the new X-O again, but that's about all the Valiant I'm reading these days.

    That's definitely the danger of their 8 title a month approach. I know that there are definitely titles that they're not currently running that I would prefer over some of the stuff that they have been running.

    Bloodshot has been very good in each incarnation.
    Ninjak has been consistent.
    I'd be willing to trade Faith, A+A, Generation Zero and completely excising Q&W from the Valiant universe to bring back Imperium and Ivar Timewalker and the first go-round of Archer and Armstrong in a heartbeat.
  • luke52luke52 Posts: 1,392
    Talking of ways to get their readership up, has any one downloaded the Raconteur app? Essentially it's a way to read comics cinematically. You read the book and as you go the comic is animated and you also get music and sfx to go along with it. Valiant has a lot of books on here, including a few freebies. I just read Generation Zero #1 this way. Can't decide if I liked it or not. Think I'll try a couple more to see if it grows on me the more I read.

    Anyone else read any books this way, I know Marvek has had something similar, is it worth investing anymore time and/or money on?
  • hauberkhauberk Posts: 1,511
    luke52 said:

    Talking of ways to get their readership up, has any one downloaded the Raconteur app? Essentially it's a way to read comics cinematically. You read the book and as you go the comic is animated and you also get music and sfx to go along with it. Valiant has a lot of books on here, including a few freebies. I just read Generation Zero #1 this way. Can't decide if I liked it or not. Think I'll try a couple more to see if it grows on me the more I read.

    Anyone else read any books this way, I know Marvek has had something similar, is it worth investing anymore time and/or money on?

    I have not, but I'm still not sold on reading comics digitally.
  • luke52luke52 Posts: 1,392
    New X-O was great. Can understand all the hype it's been getting. Kindt setting up another epic and the art was incredible.
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