I am a long time fan of Star Trek and really enjoyed "Into Darkness" and strongly disliked the first reboot movie. I just could never accept that one mining ship, even 100 years advanced, could nearly wipe out everything in its path.
How many of the Star Trek movies have actually been good? 6 or 7 at best and that is pushing it. Star Trek has always been more enjoyable to me as a televison franchise with the movies being hit or miss. For me the good movies are:
1. Wrath of Kahn 2. Undiscovered Country 3. Into Darkness 4. Voyage Home 5. First Contact
I do think Final Frontier is a enjoyable "bad movie"
The Motion Picture, Nemesis, and Star Trek (reboot) are nearly unwatchable. The rest are just ok.
If I were to rank every Trek film in order, I think it rolls out like this:
1. Wrath of Khan 2. First Contact 3. Star Trek (reboot) 4. The Undiscovered Country 5. The Voyage Home 6. Into Darkness 7. Nemesis 8. Generations 9. The Final Frontier 10. The Search for Spock 11. The Motion Picture 12. Insurrection
Though I go back and forth about how I'd order #s 2 through 4. The order above is where it stays for now, but ask me another day and I might order them differently.
The Final Frontier may have its issues, but at least it isn't boring. The Search for Spock, OTOH, is sooooooo slow, much more so than I remember it being at the time. Not as slow as TMP, but still slow. Insurrection, meanwhile, was just plain awful.
I'm a bit of an rare breed Star Trek Fan. I have always been obsessed with TNG and DS9, and found Voyager tolerable (...only sometimes), and Enterprise "unique". I loved all of the movies except the original "Star Trek The Movie" which I fell asleep for. I've seen every episode of the above.
The Original Series on the other hand, I just cant get through. I love the characters, I really do, but that's a generation of television I can't get past, and I have a very strong and reliable "Suspension of Disbelief". I realize that for the time it was amazing, but quite frankly, for now, its terrible. I hate myself for this, and most people would say I could never be "hardcore" Trek fan because of this (they can bugger off).
As for the JJ films, I think they are bloody fantastic. Of course, given what I just wrote you may think that this is because it has great special FX and that absolves them of anything else. However, I actually felt very pulled-in by the first movie, and being so absorbed into the greater Star Trek Cannon I felt it incredibly refreshing to see a new take on it.
Into Darkness was no exception. While, like many of you I found it easy to guess the "Kirk behind the glass" twist, I had only heard rumours that Cumberbatch was Khan and was absolutely giddy when this happened. Same goes for Carol Marcus, although I had secretly hoped that the torpedoes were in fact a type of "Genesis Weapon".
While the movie was not perfect (I didn't like the Tribble foreshadowing, coming back to life... they could have had Old Spock mention the regenerative properties, or McCoy as soon as he scanned Khan) I felt it out-did the previous film in almost every way (Now with 75% less lens flare!).
Yes there was a great deal of pandering to the Star Trek fan-boy in this film, (the many many Wrath of Khan plot similarities from the ship destruction to the radiation deaths, The Section 31 reference etc etc etc). But you know what? I went for it hook line and sinker. The entire time I saw this movie in the theatre I was grinning from ear to ear like a kid on Christmas, because JJ found a way to link this one to the hundreds of hours of Star Trek that I've put my poor brain through over the past twenty-some years
JJ once said my favourite description about my two favourite Sci Fi Franchises. He said Star Wars was like Rock n Roll and Star Trek was like Classical Music. A lot of people are upset that his Star Trek films have been much more Rock n Roll, and parting too much from the rich storytelling and drama, and you would be absolutely right. I too lament this fact, however the Star Trek FILMS have always had much more Rock n Roll to them when you compare them to the series's, and the ones that are pure Classical Music are the exception, not the rule.
I realize I've written a short novel on this topic so I'll just end with this: These films are reboots. Think of it like an Ultimate Universe that is freshening things up, and they are not gonna do things the same, or else it would BE the same. And in the end, they can't reproduce in drama and plot what took five full-length television series and ten films to build over the course of just two films.
so, I loved the flick and had a great time watching it but upon reflection... the end bit where spock chases Kahn down for the regenerative properties in his blood...high drama I know but...doesn't McCoy have 72 torpedoes filled with Kahn like super solders? he really doesn't need KAHN's blood. Now, having Spock kick the shit out of Cumberbatch just on general principle, i'm still down with that whole scene. I think maybe one line of dialogue to clarify that plot hole would have made me happy.
I'm a bit of an rare breed Star Trek Fan. I have always been obsessed with TNG and DS9, and found Voyager tolerable (...only sometimes), and Enterprise "unique". I loved all of the movies except the original "Star Trek The Movie" which I fell asleep for. I've seen every episode of the above.
The Original Series on the other hand, I just cant get through. I love the characters, I really do, but that's a generation of television I can't get past, and I have a very strong and reliable "Suspension of Disbelief". I realize that for the time it was amazing, but quite frankly, for now, its terrible. I hate myself for this, and most people would say I could never be "hardcore" Trek fan because of this (they can bugger off).
As for the JJ films, I think they are bloody fantastic. Of course, given what I just wrote you may think that this is because it has great special FX and that absolves them of anything else. However, I actually felt very pulled-in by the first movie, and being so absorbed into the greater Star Trek Cannon I felt it incredibly refreshing to see a new take on it.
Into Darkness was no exception. While, like many of you I found it easy to guess the "Kirk behind the glass" twist, I had only heard rumours that Cumberbatch was Khan and was absolutely giddy when this happened. Same goes for Carol Marcus, although I had secretly hoped that the torpedoes were in fact a type of "Genesis Weapon".
While the movie was not perfect (I didn't like the Tribble foreshadowing, coming back to life... they could have had Old Spock mention the regenerative properties, or McCoy as soon as he scanned Khan) I felt it out-did the previous film in almost every way (Now with 75% less lens flare!).
Yes there was a great deal of pandering to the Star Trek fan-boy in this film, (the many many Wrath of Khan plot similarities from the ship destruction to the radiation deaths, The Section 31 reference etc etc etc). But you know what? I went for it hook line and sinker. The entire time I saw this movie in the theatre I was grinning from ear to ear like a kid on Christmas, because JJ found a way to link this one to the hundreds of hours of Star Trek that I've put my poor brain through over the past twenty-some years
JJ once said my favourite description about my two favourite Sci Fi Franchises. He said Star Wars was like Rock n Roll and Star Trek was like Classical Music. A lot of people are upset that his Star Trek films have been much more Rock n Roll, and parting too much from the rich storytelling and drama, and you would be absolutely right. I too lament this fact, however the Star Trek FILMS have always had much more Rock n Roll to them when you compare them to the series's, and the ones that are pure Classical Music are the exception, not the rule.
I realize I've written a short novel on this topic so I'll just end with this: These films are reboots. Think of it like an Ultimate Universe that is freshening things up, and they are not gonna do things the same, or else it would BE the same. And in the end, they can't reproduce in drama and plot what took five full-length television series and ten films to build over the course of just two films.
Assuming his crew had the blood properties as Khan, the torpedoes are basically like Genesis.
no, i mean the super soldier filled torpedoes strike me as a little different than the complicated specifically designed genesis device. if they were to lauch kahns crew at the planet and have the result be the transformation of a dead planet my ability to suspend my disbelief would be shot.
@Bondo, the word is 'canon', not 'cannon'. Now you've got me picturing a huge gun on Starfleet grounds in San Francisco that shoots starships into orbit!
And @Matt -- who I think should really know better -- you've got me envisioning planets of royalty being wiped out by the Genesis Effect!! The word you want is 'barren', not 'baron'.
Really, I held out as long as I could -- but two misspelled words within a handful of posts was all my copy-editing skills could stand!
@Bondo, the word is 'canon', not 'cannon'. Now you've got me picturing a huge gun on Starfleet grounds in San Francisco that shoots starships into orbit!
And @Matt -- who I think should really know better -- you've got me envisioning planets of royalty being wiped out by the Genesis Effect!! The word you want is 'barren', not 'baron'.
Really, I held out as long as I could -- but two misspelled words within a handful of posts was all my copy-editing skills could stand!
@Bondo, the word is 'canon', not 'cannon'. Now you've got me picturing a huge gun on Starfleet grounds in San Francisco that shoots starships into orbit!
And @Matt -- who I think should really know better -- you've got me envisioning planets of royalty being wiped out by the Genesis Effect!! The word you want is 'barren', not 'baron'.
Really, I held out as long as I could -- but two misspelled words within a handful of posts was all my copy-editing skills could stand!
Lol this made me legitimately chuckle out loud. I let things like that slide because I assume people are, like me, typing on a cell phone. I only get crazy when live humans insist on inserting. B in the word supposedly. Drives me freakin crazy.
Comments
How many of the Star Trek movies have actually been good? 6 or 7 at best and that is pushing it.
Star Trek has always been more enjoyable to me as a televison franchise with the movies being hit or miss. For me the good movies are:
1. Wrath of Kahn
2. Undiscovered Country
3. Into Darkness
4. Voyage Home
5. First Contact
I do think Final Frontier is a enjoyable "bad movie"
The Motion Picture, Nemesis, and Star Trek (reboot) are nearly unwatchable. The rest are just ok.
1. Wrath of Khan
2. First Contact
3. Star Trek (reboot)
4. The Undiscovered Country
5. The Voyage Home
6. Into Darkness
7. Nemesis
8. Generations
9. The Final Frontier
10. The Search for Spock
11. The Motion Picture
12. Insurrection
Though I go back and forth about how I'd order #s 2 through 4. The order above is where it stays for now, but ask me another day and I might order them differently.
The Final Frontier may have its issues, but at least it isn't boring. The Search for Spock, OTOH, is sooooooo slow, much more so than I remember it being at the time. Not as slow as TMP, but still slow. Insurrection, meanwhile, was just plain awful.
:-bd
The Original Series on the other hand, I just cant get through. I love the characters, I really do, but that's a generation of television I can't get past, and I have a very strong and reliable "Suspension of Disbelief". I realize that for the time it was amazing, but quite frankly, for now, its terrible. I hate myself for this, and most people would say I could never be "hardcore" Trek fan because of this (they can bugger off).
As for the JJ films, I think they are bloody fantastic. Of course, given what I just wrote you may think that this is because it has great special FX and that absolves them of anything else. However, I actually felt very pulled-in by the first movie, and being so absorbed into the greater Star Trek Cannon I felt it incredibly refreshing to see a new take on it.
Into Darkness was no exception. While, like many of you I found it easy to guess the "Kirk behind the glass" twist, I had only heard rumours that Cumberbatch was Khan and was absolutely giddy when this happened. Same goes for Carol Marcus, although I had secretly hoped that the torpedoes were in fact a type of "Genesis Weapon".
While the movie was not perfect (I didn't like the Tribble foreshadowing, coming back to life... they could have had Old Spock mention the regenerative properties, or McCoy as soon as he scanned Khan) I felt it out-did the previous film in almost every way (Now with 75% less lens flare!).
Yes there was a great deal of pandering to the Star Trek fan-boy in this film, (the many many Wrath of Khan plot similarities from the ship destruction to the radiation deaths, The Section 31 reference etc etc etc). But you know what? I went for it hook line and sinker. The entire time I saw this movie in the theatre I was grinning from ear to ear like a kid on Christmas, because JJ found a way to link this one to the hundreds of hours of Star Trek that I've put my poor brain through over the past twenty-some years
JJ once said my favourite description about my two favourite Sci Fi Franchises. He said Star Wars was like Rock n Roll and Star Trek was like Classical Music. A lot of people are upset that his Star Trek films have been much more Rock n Roll, and parting too much from the rich storytelling and drama, and you would be absolutely right. I too lament this fact, however the Star Trek FILMS have always had much more Rock n Roll to them when you compare them to the series's, and the ones that are pure Classical Music are the exception, not the rule.
I realize I've written a short novel on this topic so I'll just end with this: These films are reboots. Think of it like an Ultimate Universe that is freshening things up, and they are not gonna do things the same, or else it would BE the same. And in the end, they can't reproduce in drama and plot what took five full-length television series and ten films to build over the course of just two films.
M
M
To some extend, ID Khan was the reverse. He was used to make weapons, then became used to bring life back to the dead.
M
@Bondo, the word is 'canon', not 'cannon'. Now you've got me picturing a huge gun on Starfleet grounds in San Francisco that shoots starships into orbit!
And @Matt -- who I think should really know better -- you've got me envisioning planets of royalty being wiped out by the Genesis Effect!! The word you want is 'barren', not 'baron'.
Really, I held out as long as I could -- but two misspelled words within a handful of posts was all my copy-editing skills could stand!
M