On the subject of the USA Today, it's still in publication. I work for AccuWeather (in State College) and we do their weather page every day. :)
I was disappointed that Captain Canuck's new series wasn't mentioned. I thought for sure it would catch your collective eye. The web series was really quite enjoyable, and the new ongoing by Kalman Andrasofszky looks like it's going to have a very Ed Brubaker Captain America-type feel to it. I've been really excited for its launch for some time now.
For anyone who is unaware, Adam Withers and Comfort Love's "Complete Guide To Self Publishing Comics " is available this month from DCBS for 45% off! Here's the description:
For the first time in history, those looking to break into comics have an enormous number of realistic, proven options for doing so all by themselves, without having to rely on big comics publishers. It's an exciting time, but a confusing one for neophytes overwhelmed by numerous options. The Complete Guide to Self-Publishing Comics is the first book of its kind to help readers make sense of it all and take control of their comics-making destinies. It provides would-be creators with a definitive guide to the tools needed for breaking into modern comics via self-publishing. For those looking to create comics on their own terms, this book provides a road map to success.
Just wanted you guys (especially Chris) to know that you can already read Empire: Uprising and Insufferable (plus a whole bunch of other great comics) on Mark Waid's thrillbent.com (or, download the app).
I also want to echo Peteloaf about Insufferable and Empire:Uprising already being available over on Thrillbent, In fact Insufferable launched in 2012 so it is already quite far along.
I also went all-in on Covergence and ordered the bundle, but am unsure how much Marvel Secret War's stuff I will get if any.
Also I will mention that I got a chance to interview Gerry Conway about his return to Spider-man on my podcast. A huge pleasure and my favorite interview I have done to date. The man is a legend and he was awesome to talk to. Here is the link to the episode.
I have always loved Silver Surfer, but Allred's art makes it unreadable for me.
Jace - is it the bright colors that do it? I for one absolutely LOVE the art. I think I like it because it is different from almost everything else that is out on the shelves nowadays. Similar to Saga and even Walking Dead - just a different look makes the book stand out. Not to mention, the writing on Silver Surfer has taken Norrin into a new place and I am absolutely devouring it!
I have always loved Silver Surfer, but Allred's art makes it unreadable for me.
Jace - is it the bright colors that do it? I for one absolutely LOVE the art. I think I like it because it is different from almost everything else that is out on the shelves nowadays. Similar to Saga and even Walking Dead - just a different look makes the book stand out. Not to mention, the writing on Silver Surfer has taken Norrin into a new place and I am absolutely devouring it!
No definitely not the colors, it is the thickness of the lines and the very stiff looking poses. I have tried to read stuff done by him multiple times and I can just never get through it. Different strokes for different folks though. I don't think it is crap, or that no one should like it or that he doesn't have talent. It just isn't my cup of tea.
Fight Club 2!!! So excited for this...the only question is do I buy the issues or the trade. Ah, who am I kidding..both.
The Little Nemo book has been great. My 8 year old son really, really enjoys it. It drove him bonkers that it was bi-monthly. A good lesson in patience I guess. I highly recommend the TPB to both young and old alike.
A new East of West trade this month. That plus Manhattan Projects, Dying and the Dead, Secret Wars, etc..this guy is a machine.
@Adam_Murdough I'll be passing on the SW Infinity Gauntlet book too. However, I just wanted to point out that Gerry Duggan also writes Nova and he is doing a wonderful job with the book. I wouldn't let the fact he's written Deadpool keep you away from any future projects you might otherwise be interested in. :)
I have always loved Silver Surfer, but Allred's art makes it unreadable for me.
Jace - is it the bright colors that do it? I for one absolutely LOVE the art. I think I like it because it is different from almost everything else that is out on the shelves nowadays. Similar to Saga and even Walking Dead - just a different look makes the book stand out. Not to mention, the writing on Silver Surfer has taken Norrin into a new place and I am absolutely devouring it!
No definitely not the colors, it is the thickness of the lines and the very stiff looking poses. I have tried to read stuff done by him multiple times and I can just never get through it. Different strokes for different folks though. I don't think it is crap, or that no one should like it or that he doesn't have talent. It just isn't my cup of tea.
I've been re-reading Silver Surfer (Vol 3) issues #34-#50 as a prelude to re-reading the Infinity Gauntlet for the upcoming BOMC episode, due any day now. It is not popular to say so, but I prefer Ron Lim, Buscema, and especially Kirby's renditions of the Sentinel of the Spaceways MUCH more than Kike Allred's. Like others here, I just don't like Allred's artwork. I think it is far too asymmetrical and childish looking for me, like a cross between poor indie art and the worst versions of Archie comics. He doesn't even appear to be a competent draftsman to me.
I think that many of those that enjoy his art do so because it is very different and not mainstream. Those attributes actually distract from my enjoyment of the book as well. The writing is what saves it, barely, because it isn't that daring or inventive. And we all know the Doctor Who tropes Slott has swiped for this version. And even if it could be argued that Allred's style is similar to Kirby's, I'd disagree with that assertion. With Kirby, space felt big, expansive. With Allred's art, it feels flat and small.
Having done all that bashing, I will say that many fans of this series are not only new to the Silver Surfer, they're new to comics and they are definitely enthralled with the art, the writing style, and Dawn. That is definitely a good thing. More people reading comics. I don't have to like everything on the shelf. But, having such a large collection of Silver Surfer books, from the very first graphic novel by Stan Lee and Jack Kirby, to a near complete run of the volume 3 series, it believe it may be time that I faced the possibility that this version of Norrin Radd's history just isn't for me after all...
I enjoy Allred's art and, for me, it's fine for the Silver Surfer book. I just don't care for the kind of stories Slott is telling with the surfer. Slott would be a great Doctor Who writer but SS isn't Who and trying to force him into that roll just doesn't jive with me. Again, I know I'm in the minority as most love the book. Like @bralinator says, that's great, more people reading comics is a good thing. I'll just hold out for a book where Surfer isn't role playing as The Doctor.
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I'm not really buying into all these Secret Wars one-shots and minis(Old Man Logan being the exception). I don't really see the reason for them and I doubt they'll have any impact on the story Hickman is telling.
What I bought this month:
Looking at it like this makes it seem like I didn't get much but my wallet reminds me that I did.
First things first, all you Allred detractors are certainly entitled to your opinions. The following is not meant as a slight to anyone, nor am I trying to convince anyone they’re “wrong.” @bralinator, my comments will be mostly in response to you, but only because you've posted the most about your what you don't like about his artwork, and have been more specific than most, so please don't feel that I'm targeting this post at you. I'm not (though you may want to go in and edit your unfortunate typo of Mike’s name). I'm just trying to have a discussion about comic book art. And please excuse the length of this post.
I love John Buscema’s take on the Silver Surfer (Silver Surfer #4 of the original series is one of the best-drawn superhero comics of all time), and Kirby’s (I still have my first printing of the Lee/Kirby OGN that I bought for $4 back in the early ’80s when a local bookstore was going out of business, and I love it). I even have a fondness for Lim’s long run back in the early ’90s (I even have a Surfer sketch Ron drew for me in San Diego years ago). And, of course, I love what Mike is doing on the book.
The typical complaint I hear about Mike’s art is that it looks “childish,” or as I believe Deemer once put it, “like a 4th grader drew it.” Obviously that’s hyperbole, but let's look at Mike’s influences. When he was very young, he read a lot of comics, a lot of them Kirby comics, but the Batman TV show had a more profound impact on him than those comics, and by the time he was a teenager, he was more interested in music than comics. When he went to college, he started out in the Art (as in fine art) department, but then switched to Broadcasting and TV Production. When he got back into comics in his early 20s, it was the work of Los Hernandez Bros. and Matt Wagner that reignited his interest. And then he backtracked and rediscovered the artists whose work he loved as a kid.
So, yes, there is a lot of Kirby in Mike’s work (it’s more in terms of his layouts, but you can see it in some of his poses and panel compositions), but it’s through the filter of Jaime Hernandez and Matt Wagner and Bernie Mireault, and through the filter of ’60s pop culture. When most people say Kirby, they're referring to the Kirby of the late ’60s, but look at Kirby’s ’50s and early ’60s work—particularly Stuntmaster and Fighting American—and you'll see something more akin to what Mike does.
Which brings me to the term “draftsman.” In the art world, draftsmanship is generally equated to technical accuracy. In comics, the top draftsmen are guys like José Luis García-López and John Buscema. Mike is not a draftsman—though he could be if that were his preference; he does have the foundation skill—but then, neither was Kirby. As I've said before, every comic book artist has some degree of cartooning in their drawing. Even José and Buscema. Cartooning is the development of an iconography that represents life in a simplified—or to be more precise, a deductive—form. Mike is a cartoonist, and a darn good one.
As to his work being stiff, I think he does fall into that trap at times during the inking stage. His pencils are looser and generally more energetic—except for when he’s shooting directly from the pencils with no inks. I think at times he is too laborious with his inking, and he loses some of that energy.
I could go on, and perhaps I will depending on the responses, if any, to this. But I'll leave off with some pages from Madman Atomic Comics #3, where Mike does homages to all his favorite artists. And remember that it’s Mike drawing everything (though using reference).
As I said in my post, there is no doubt the man is talented. And I begrudge no one who likes him or sings his praises. It is just for me I dislike his 'style' so much that it detracts from the story to the point that I simply cannot enjoy it. Nothing personal against Mike, that's just my preference. As far as layouts or his progression of story-telling from panel to panel and for the stories overall. I really couldn't give a fair assessment as I haven't read/seen enough of his work.
I'm so glad that you're going to be doing a Dirk Gently "Off The Rack" as I'm a huge Douglas Adams fan. The man had a gift for titles such as the second Dirk Gently book, "The Long Dark Teatime of The Soul".
I generally like Allred's art but it seems kinda one-trick-pony or something to me. On first glance it looks fun and great to me... then after a while it seems inexplicably less exciting. Not quite "stale", but getting there. Maybe the alleged "stiffness" has something to do with it. All I know is that everytime I see something by him, I like it initially and instinctively, but the more I see it (in a single sitting or over the course of a single run) the less it holds my interest.
I wish the Geeks who like the current Silver Surfer series would say more about what happens in it. Personally I don't care about spoilers ever, but surely there'd be a way to discuss books beyond just listing the creators and cast over and over again. The Geeks have talked about S.S. many times now. All I've gotten from it is that it's Slott and Allred, the surfboard is sort of a character, there's a girl, and now finally in this episode I get the new tidbit of information that something happened with Galactus: this something is claimed to be an instant "classic" storyline, but that contention was left hanging there and nothing whatsoever was said to describe it further. I've been on the verge of trying the series ever since it was announced, but still haven't heard enough particulars to push me to pick it up.
The above paragraph probably sounds crabbier than I intended. I enjoy the discussions, but I just wish the casual conversations would go into things with slightly greater depth sometimes. In my entire history of CGS listening, I can't tell you the number of times when someone would begin to discuss something that's happening in a current comic, only to be waved off by another Geek with the admonishment of "[Stop!] Spoilers!". Over the last few years it seems like this admonishment has become internalized, because the Geeks rarely attempt to relate recent storylines even in vague, general ways. I find myself really wanting to hear at least something more about these titles. I read Daredevil and enjoy it, for example, but I feel that all CGS has ever said about it, after dozens of name-checks, is that it's by Waid and Samnee and that Foggy has had cancer.
I'll be passing on the SW Infinity Gauntlet book too. However, I just wanted to point out that Gerry Duggan also writes Nova and he is doing a wonderful job with the book. I wouldn't let the fact he's written Deadpool keep you away from any future projects you might otherwise be interested in. :)
Duggan is a good writer. The current Deadpool run is rivaling Joe Kelly's for top run in the character's history amongst fans. I've not been reading Nova, and I'd probably be picking up SW Infinity Gauntlet anyway due to Thanos and Dustin Weaver's involvement. But Duggan is definitely a plus for me.
I've been re-reading Silver Surfer (Vol 3) issues #34-#50 as a prelude to re-reading the Infinity Gauntlet for the upcoming BOMC episode, due any day now.
I've been reading and/or rereading that run, too! I had a handful of issues, but I've begun tracking down my gaps in dollar bins. (And in the case of the pricier issues, like #44, the first appearance of the Infinity Gauntlet, I've been fine with paying some decent dollars for them.) It's a great freaking run. Ron Lim of the early '90s is definitely an under-appreciated artist.
And, yes, the Toth book is the standout for me this month. Now if only DC would do a collection of all Toth's work for them.
Totally missed that Toth book when I submitted my DCBS order. Luckily I was able to go back and add it. For $12 with the discount, that couldn't be passed up.
And yes, @nweathington, a complete DC Toth collection would be amazing. Hell, I'd settle for just a nice collection of his stories from the Hot Wheels book they put out! For a largely forgotten cartoon & toy tie-in comic, that's a master class in cartooning.
Oh, and yes, Gotham Academy is a great read. It's geared toward the YA audience, but like any really good YA novel it's appealing to older readers as well. It's spooky, it's atmospheric, and though Batman rarely appears, it's like Gotham Central in that he's always a presence. Plus, lots of references to well-known Gothamites past and present (if you enjoy the sort of GC history Scott Snyder has been laying down, there's a lot of that here), and even a few cameos from other Bat-media (Gotham Academy's drama teacher is Simon Trent, the Grey Ghost!).
Becky Cloonan is killing it on the writing, Karl Kerschl and the color artists (not sure of their names) are ultra-killing it on art... give it a shot.
First things first, all you Allred detractors are certainly entitled to your opinions. The following is not meant as a slight to anyone, nor am I trying to convince anyone they’re “wrong.”
Eric, thanks for a very thoughtful and insightful response, but in the end - as you well know, art is subjective. I'm sure all of us have different tastes in music, food, and other cultural pursuits and most of us are able to define what we do or do not like about them.
I think Allred's artwork is flat, asymmetrical, and most of his faces all look exactly the same (a comment that could be made about Jack "King" Kirby for sure).
I just prefer a different style than what we're getting on this current run. It doesn't have to be George Perez or Ron Lim again, but even artists like Evan "Doc" Shaner, Greg Capullo, Cameron Stewart, Fiona Staples, Esad Ribic, Darwyn Cooke, Bruce Timm, or Ramon Perez are much more appealing to my eyes. While art from Jamie McKelvie, Javier Pulido, Ron Wimberly, or sometimes even David Aja or Chris Samnee, just don't do that much for me. Their work certainly gets the job done, yet sometimes it even distracts, and I'm never "blown away" with much of the art work from this latter group. This is equally so with Allred.
For instance, I'd much rather see an artist like James Harren doing Silver Surfer than Allred. But again, it's just a preference in style.
We could debate the reasons that I like something that you don't like and vice versa for a very long time, but it might be more productive to actually try to understand why some people don't like what you like and why it may be equally valid.
I've been reading and/or rereading that run, too! I had a handful of issues, but I've begun tracking down my gaps in dollar bins. (And in the case of the pricier issues, like #44, the first appearance of the Infinity Gauntlet, I've been fine with paying some decent dollars for them.) It's a great freaking run. Ron Lim of the early '90s is definitely an under-appreciated artist.
It is a great run. A lot of fun, and I agree that Ron Lim is under-appreciated. I'm looking forward to the discussion of Infinity Gauntlet any day now. I believe @David_D reported that it's a February BOMC selection. I don't mind it being a bit late, because I want to finish going back through the prelude material beforehand and I have several issues to go.
And, yes, the Toth book is the standout for me this month. Now if only DC would do a collection of all Toth's work for them.
Totally missed that Toth book when I submitted my DCBS order. Luckily I was able to go back and add it. For $12 with the discount, that couldn't be passed up.
And yes, @nweathington, a complete DC Toth collection would be amazing. Hell, I'd settle for just a nice collection of his stories from the Hot Wheels book they put out! For a largely forgotten cartoon & toy tie-in comic, that's a master class in cartooning.
They'll never reprint the Hot Wheels stuff. That would require spending money on licensing. I'd be satisfied with his Johnny Thunder (the western character), Big Town, “Roving Ranger,” “Sierra Smith,” and Rex the Wonder Dog stories.
@LibraryBoy, this month’s Previews (the one that came out this week) has a complete collection of Toth’s Bravo for Adventure stories from IDW.
We could debate the reasons that I like something that you don't like and vice versa for a very long time, but it might be more productive to actually try to understand why some people don't like what you like and why it may be equally valid.
Oh, I perfectly well understand why people don’t like Allred’s artwork, and I'm fine with that. Allred has a very specific point of view in his artwork, and artists who have such a distinct style are usually more apt to have a galvanizing effect on viewers.
But I believe a distinction needs to be made here. You don't like Mike’s artwork. I find that perfectly valid, and I completely understand. You think Mike’s work looks childish and incompetent. I do not find that to be valid in any way, and I never will. I know you like to speak in hyperbole, but it's clearly obvious that the work is neither of those things.
I think Allred's artwork is flat, asymmetrical, and most of his faces all look exactly the same (a comment that could be made about Jack "King" Kirby for sure).
Now, this statement is something I can give validation to. I don't completely agree with it, but I can see why you would think so, and why it would turn you off to the work.
Yes, Mike’s work is relatively flat. The more an artist simplifies, the flatter the drawing tends to get. The trick every artist has to learn is what to leave out. As I've mentioned, I'm a big fan of Alex Toth—one of the most deductive artists to ever draw a comic. He was always striving to figure out what to leave out—in other words, the bare minimum of lines needed to make the image readable and still convey the necessary information to tell the story. I find that to be a noble and fascinating quest. And Mike, I think, has found a point in that quest where he’s comfortable.
As for the faces, I'll meet you halfway. He has a pretty standard “hero” face for his male lead types, and a fairly standard “pretty woman” face for his female lead types. Like Kirby, he relies more on iconography for facial details than someone like George Pérez, which adds to the “sameness.” But the same could be said for the vast majority of comic book artists.
I'm a little confused about what you're referring to when you say “asymmetrical.” Because I don’t see it. Not in the faces, not in the full figures. Can you show me some examples of what you mean?
A quick question to anyone who has the CGS app. I bought the app awhile ago but I have yet to hear any bonus material. Have any of the recent episodes had any and I am just not accessing it somehow. Or has the recent upheaval with weather, the 10th anniversary and traveling to another continent prevented Pants from putting any bonus stuff on the episodes?
A quick question to anyone who has the CGS app. I bought the app awhile ago but I have yet to hear any bonus material. Have any of the recent episodes had any and I am just not accessing it somehow. Or has the recent upheaval with weather, the 10th anniversary and traveling to another continent prevented Pants from putting any bonus stuff on the episodes?
Look for the "e" icon towards the bottom of the screen. That's where the bonus goodies can be found.
A quick question to anyone who has the CGS app. I bought the app awhile ago but I have yet to hear any bonus material. Have any of the recent episodes had any and I am just not accessing it somehow. Or has the recent upheaval with weather, the 10th anniversary and traveling to another continent prevented Pants from putting any bonus stuff on the episodes?
Look for the "e" icon towards the bottom of the screen. That's where the bonus goodies can be found.
And, yes, the Toth book is the standout for me this month. Now if only DC would do a collection of all Toth's work for them.
Totally missed that Toth book when I submitted my DCBS order. Luckily I was able to go back and add it. For $12 with the discount, that couldn't be passed up.
And yes, @nweathington, a complete DC Toth collection would be amazing. Hell, I'd settle for just a nice collection of his stories from the Hot Wheels book they put out! For a largely forgotten cartoon & toy tie-in comic, that's a master class in cartooning.
Yes, it was. That Hot Wheels series, short-lived as it was, was a big favorite of mine when it came out. Alas, I no longer have a set, and cannot afford it through eBay...
I think the art for Silver Surfer works, but only because the book is "quirky" and the artwork fits it, in my opinion. I wouldn't be a fan of that style in a more serious book though.
I'm listening right now, wondering if I ordered any of the off-the-rack selections you made since the episode is a bit late. Hmm...alright, so far I got two out of three! Yay! But aw, man! I didn't see Tuki! Oh, well... As for Allred: I loved his Madman, the ATomics, and X-Force even before Silver Surfer. So, I think he has a distinctive kind of retro style that I like a lot.
Yes, it was. That Hot Wheels series, short-lived as it was, was a big favorite of mine when it came out. Alas, I no longer have a set, and cannot afford it through eBay...
Yeah, that can be very pricey books in those very rare occasions you can even find 'em. I have 3 issues in just-barely-reader-copy condition, and luckily I found them when local comic shops were having hugely discounted sales.
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And, yes, the Toth book is the standout for me this month. Now if only DC would do a collection of all Toth's work for them.
I was disappointed that Captain Canuck's new series wasn't mentioned. I thought for sure it would catch your collective eye. The web series was really quite enjoyable, and the new ongoing by Kalman Andrasofszky looks like it's going to have a very Ed Brubaker Captain America-type feel to it. I've been really excited for its launch for some time now.
I also went all-in on Covergence and ordered the bundle, but am unsure how much Marvel Secret War's stuff I will get if any.
Also I will mention that I got a chance to interview Gerry Conway about his return to Spider-man on my podcast. A huge pleasure and my favorite interview I have done to date. The man is a legend and he was awesome to talk to. Here is the link to the episode.
thecomicsourceblog.com/007-top-cow-chronology-project-convention-special/
I have always loved Silver Surfer, but Allred's art makes it unreadable for me.
Just kidding, I really do enjoy these behind the scenes clips. Keep up the good work guys.
No definitely not the colors, it is the thickness of the lines and the very stiff looking poses. I have tried to read stuff done by him multiple times and I can just never get through it. Different strokes for different folks though. I don't think it is crap, or that no one should like it or that he doesn't have talent. It just isn't my cup of tea.
The Little Nemo book has been great. My 8 year old son really, really enjoys it. It drove him bonkers that it was bi-monthly. A good lesson in patience I guess. I highly recommend the TPB to both young and old alike.
A new East of West trade this month. That plus Manhattan Projects, Dying and the Dead, Secret Wars, etc..this guy is a machine.
@Adam_Murdough I'll be passing on the SW Infinity Gauntlet book too. However, I just wanted to point out that Gerry Duggan also writes Nova and he is doing a wonderful job with the book. I wouldn't let the fact he's written Deadpool keep you away from any future projects you might otherwise be interested in. :)
I think that many of those that enjoy his art do so because it is very different and not mainstream. Those attributes actually distract from my enjoyment of the book as well. The writing is what saves it, barely, because it isn't that daring or inventive. And we all know the Doctor Who tropes Slott has swiped for this version. And even if it could be argued that Allred's style is similar to Kirby's, I'd disagree with that assertion. With Kirby, space felt big, expansive. With Allred's art, it feels flat and small.
Having done all that bashing, I will say that many fans of this series are not only new to the Silver Surfer, they're new to comics and they are definitely enthralled with the art, the writing style, and Dawn. That is definitely a good thing. More people reading comics. I don't have to like everything on the shelf. But, having such a large collection of Silver Surfer books, from the very first graphic novel by Stan Lee and Jack Kirby, to a near complete run of the volume 3 series, it believe it may be time that I faced the possibility that this version of Norrin Radd's history just isn't for me after all...
sad face... :(
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I'm not really buying into all these Secret Wars one-shots and minis(Old Man Logan being the exception). I don't really see the reason for them and I doubt they'll have any impact on the story Hickman is telling.
What I bought this month:
Looking at it like this makes it seem like I didn't get much but my wallet reminds me that I did.
I love John Buscema’s take on the Silver Surfer (Silver Surfer #4 of the original series is one of the best-drawn superhero comics of all time), and Kirby’s (I still have my first printing of the Lee/Kirby OGN that I bought for $4 back in the early ’80s when a local bookstore was going out of business, and I love it). I even have a fondness for Lim’s long run back in the early ’90s (I even have a Surfer sketch Ron drew for me in San Diego years ago). And, of course, I love what Mike is doing on the book.
The typical complaint I hear about Mike’s art is that it looks “childish,” or as I believe Deemer once put it, “like a 4th grader drew it.” Obviously that’s hyperbole, but let's look at Mike’s influences. When he was very young, he read a lot of comics, a lot of them Kirby comics, but the Batman TV show had a more profound impact on him than those comics, and by the time he was a teenager, he was more interested in music than comics. When he went to college, he started out in the Art (as in fine art) department, but then switched to Broadcasting and TV Production. When he got back into comics in his early 20s, it was the work of Los Hernandez Bros. and Matt Wagner that reignited his interest. And then he backtracked and rediscovered the artists whose work he loved as a kid.
So, yes, there is a lot of Kirby in Mike’s work (it’s more in terms of his layouts, but you can see it in some of his poses and panel compositions), but it’s through the filter of Jaime Hernandez and Matt Wagner and Bernie Mireault, and through the filter of ’60s pop culture. When most people say Kirby, they're referring to the Kirby of the late ’60s, but look at Kirby’s ’50s and early ’60s work—particularly Stuntmaster and Fighting American—and you'll see something more akin to what Mike does.
Which brings me to the term “draftsman.” In the art world, draftsmanship is generally equated to technical accuracy. In comics, the top draftsmen are guys like José Luis García-López and John Buscema. Mike is not a draftsman—though he could be if that were his preference; he does have the foundation skill—but then, neither was Kirby. As I've said before, every comic book artist has some degree of cartooning in their drawing. Even José and Buscema. Cartooning is the development of an iconography that represents life in a simplified—or to be more precise, a deductive—form. Mike is a cartoonist, and a darn good one.
As to his work being stiff, I think he does fall into that trap at times during the inking stage. His pencils are looser and generally more energetic—except for when he’s shooting directly from the pencils with no inks. I think at times he is too laborious with his inking, and he loses some of that energy.
I could go on, and perhaps I will depending on the responses, if any, to this. But I'll leave off with some pages from Madman Atomic Comics #3, where Mike does homages to all his favorite artists. And remember that it’s Mike drawing everything (though using reference).
Would love to hear a Convergence related show especially with @Adam_Murdough and @wildpigcomics
I wish the Geeks who like the current Silver Surfer series would say more about what happens in it. Personally I don't care about spoilers ever, but surely there'd be a way to discuss books beyond just listing the creators and cast over and over again. The Geeks have talked about S.S. many times now. All I've gotten from it is that it's Slott and Allred, the surfboard is sort of a character, there's a girl, and now finally in this episode I get the new tidbit of information that something happened with Galactus: this something is claimed to be an instant "classic" storyline, but that contention was left hanging there and nothing whatsoever was said to describe it further. I've been on the verge of trying the series ever since it was announced, but still haven't heard enough particulars to push me to pick it up.
The above paragraph probably sounds crabbier than I intended. I enjoy the discussions, but I just wish the casual conversations would go into things with slightly greater depth sometimes. In my entire history of CGS listening, I can't tell you the number of times when someone would begin to discuss something that's happening in a current comic, only to be waved off by another Geek with the admonishment of "[Stop!] Spoilers!". Over the last few years it seems like this admonishment has become internalized, because the Geeks rarely attempt to relate recent storylines even in vague, general ways. I find myself really wanting to hear at least something more about these titles. I read Daredevil and enjoy it, for example, but I feel that all CGS has ever said about it, after dozens of name-checks, is that it's by Waid and Samnee and that Foggy has had cancer. Duggan is a good writer. The current Deadpool run is rivaling Joe Kelly's for top run in the character's history amongst fans. I've not been reading Nova, and I'd probably be picking up SW Infinity Gauntlet anyway due to Thanos and Dustin Weaver's involvement. But Duggan is definitely a plus for me. I've been reading and/or rereading that run, too! I had a handful of issues, but I've begun tracking down my gaps in dollar bins. (And in the case of the pricier issues, like #44, the first appearance of the Infinity Gauntlet, I've been fine with paying some decent dollars for them.) It's a great freaking run. Ron Lim of the early '90s is definitely an under-appreciated artist.
And yes, @nweathington, a complete DC Toth collection would be amazing. Hell, I'd settle for just a nice collection of his stories from the Hot Wheels book they put out! For a largely forgotten cartoon & toy tie-in comic, that's a master class in cartooning.
Becky Cloonan is killing it on the writing, Karl Kerschl and the color artists (not sure of their names) are ultra-killing it on art... give it a shot.
Eric, thanks for a very thoughtful and insightful response, but in the end - as you well know, art is subjective. I'm sure all of us have different tastes in music, food, and other cultural pursuits and most of us are able to define what we do or do not like about them.
I think Allred's artwork is flat, asymmetrical, and most of his faces all look exactly the same (a comment that could be made about Jack "King" Kirby for sure).
I just prefer a different style than what we're getting on this current run. It doesn't have to be George Perez or Ron Lim again, but even artists like Evan "Doc" Shaner, Greg Capullo, Cameron Stewart, Fiona Staples, Esad Ribic, Darwyn Cooke, Bruce Timm, or Ramon Perez are much more appealing to my eyes. While art from Jamie McKelvie, Javier Pulido, Ron Wimberly, or sometimes even David Aja or Chris Samnee, just don't do that much for me. Their work certainly gets the job done, yet sometimes it even distracts, and I'm never "blown away" with much of the art work from this latter group. This is equally so with Allred.
For instance, I'd much rather see an artist like James Harren doing Silver Surfer than Allred. But again, it's just a preference in style.
We could debate the reasons that I like something that you don't like and vice versa for a very long time, but it might be more productive to actually try to understand why some people don't like what you like and why it may be equally valid.
@LibraryBoy, this month’s Previews (the one that came out this week) has a complete collection of Toth’s Bravo for Adventure stories from IDW.
But I believe a distinction needs to be made here. You don't like Mike’s artwork. I find that perfectly valid, and I completely understand. You think Mike’s work looks childish and incompetent. I do not find that to be valid in any way, and I never will. I know you like to speak in hyperbole, but it's clearly obvious that the work is neither of those things. Now, this statement is something I can give validation to. I don't completely agree with it, but I can see why you would think so, and why it would turn you off to the work.
Yes, Mike’s work is relatively flat. The more an artist simplifies, the flatter the drawing tends to get. The trick every artist has to learn is what to leave out. As I've mentioned, I'm a big fan of Alex Toth—one of the most deductive artists to ever draw a comic. He was always striving to figure out what to leave out—in other words, the bare minimum of lines needed to make the image readable and still convey the necessary information to tell the story. I find that to be a noble and fascinating quest. And Mike, I think, has found a point in that quest where he’s comfortable.
As for the faces, I'll meet you halfway. He has a pretty standard “hero” face for his male lead types, and a fairly standard “pretty woman” face for his female lead types. Like Kirby, he relies more on iconography for facial details than someone like George Pérez, which adds to the “sameness.” But the same could be said for the vast majority of comic book artists.
I'm a little confused about what you're referring to when you say “asymmetrical.” Because I don’t see it. Not in the faces, not in the full figures. Can you show me some examples of what you mean?