Loki (Disney Plus)
Brack
Posts: 868
The sort of time travel story my dead dad would have been mad at, in that it uses a fair amount of footage from things you've already seen in the first episode. However I really enjoyed it.
Better production design than most of the MCU movies, let alone the 2 Disney Plus shows so far, Owen Wilson makes a great foil for Hiddleston to act against. Which is probably why much of this episode is essentially a two-hander black box theatre play.
Nice use of animation in the show too. High hopes for showrunner Michael Waldron's script for the new Dr Strange movie now.
Comments
I thought the episode was okay. My theory is Loki is playing Mobius to get the power of the TVA, which looks to be far superior to the Infinity Stones/Gems. Perhaps, it’s what the other Loki variant is trying to get as well.
I think the key thing from the first episode is that we never see what the TVA's charges actually do when they go off and clean up a timeline.
Stealing the charges seems to be the Future Variant Loki's aim in attracting the attention of the Minute Men and then ambushing them.
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In terms of comics clues to the direction, the special thanks in the credits of this episode covers:
Thor #282 - First Appearance of the Time Keepers (Gruenwald, Macchio, Heck)
They probably should have thanked the Thomases and Paul Ryan for the Time Keepers too, as all you see of them is the backs of their very Gallifreyan cloaks in that Thor issue, it's not until their Avengers West Coast appearance that they get character designs. (Not coincidentally, this is the story that Wandavision cribs from).
Thor '#371 - First Appearance of the TVA (Simonson, Buscema)
Fantastic Four #353 - First Appearance of Mobius M. Mobius (Simonson)
Journey into Mystery #622-626 - First Appearance of Ikol (Gillen, Braithwaite)
Siege: Loki (Gillen, Mckelvie)
Loki: Agent of Asgard #1-5 - Ikol as Loki, King Loki from the future (Ewing, Garbett)
Notable by their absence is Fraction & Ferry as the creators of Kid Loki, and Straczynski & Copiel as creators of the female Loki. Also no Mike Norton, suggesting there's no Ikol as Kid Loki from Young Avengers here. Now all those people might get thanked later along with Christopher Hastings and Langdon Foss for Vote Loki.
But for now, everything points to it being a version of the Ikol replaces Loki story.
So the question is this:
Is the Loki we meet here in the Ikol role, and the "evil" variant the true Loki? Or vice versa? Or is it the Agent of Asgard plot where the evil future King Loki is the future version of Ikol, the variant Loki currently in the "heroic" Loki role in the comics.
I liked how the Infinitiy Stones were just in a junk drawer. The writers way of showing the audience that Stones aren't the biggest power in the universe. That we are moving on to more important things.
Hiddleston is a really good actor. Happy Loki is still around, and this show can breath new life into the character. I'm interested in seeing what point in time did the Antagonist Loki split from his "set path"
And also I'm wondering if the Dr Strange movie is going to be the origin of the time lines getting out of control and the TVA was established in response to that?
So are they combining Lady Loki and The Entchantress together? Because she looks like The Enchantress more than a Lady Loki.
@Mihawk That's the costume of the reborn God of Stories version of Loki from the end of Loki: Agent of Atlas. They switch between male and female forms (as opposed to stealing Sif's body in the JMS Thor story).
Okay, didn't know that.
@Mihawk they did acknowledge JMS & Copiel in the credits this week so it's definitely part inspired by their run (and let's face it, Al Ewing and Lee Garbett probably wouldn't have had the genderfluid Loki without it setting the precedent).
We also get Steve Englehart and Keith Pollard credited this week, which means something here came from their Fantastic Four run, and I can't figure out what yet.
@Mihawk Now, if you look at one of the dubbing credits for episode 2 (and are familiar with minor Dark Reign mini-series) you might see something that backs up your theory...
@Brack OK yeah I see she's credited as playing Sylvie, which is one of The Entchantress lol. So it could be a combination. Or maybe the "Bad" Loki has her as a helper and we're suspose to think she's Loki?
Other than her look, I just thought she's literally enchanting people when she touches them.
I’m actually hoping they just have an amalgam of Loki & Entchantress, with her taking the Entchantress name by the end. We seem to be getting too many replacement Phase One key characters.
I agree. New Cap, New Thor, New Black Widow, you know they'll have a New Iron Man eventually. If it wasn't for FF and X-Men stuff I wouldn't be that interested in the MCU. I can't believe there won't be a Steve Rogers and Wolverine scene.
Episode 3 imo was pretty bad lol. This felt like a random filler episode you'd get from a show that does 20 episode seasons. We learned a tiny bit about Sylvie, the ending was very abrupt. Just a very filler episode.
I’m glad they’re going the route I was hoping. The score for was very John Carpenter. And I think the episode was primarily what we saw in the beginning of the episode.
Englehart & Pollard still on the Special Thanks this week, and I still can't figure out what they are being thanked for!
New names!
Paul Cornell & Mark Brooks: This is the team who worked on Dark Reign: Young Avengers where the second Enchantress, Sylvie Lushton first appears. Cornell, of course, also known as a Doctor Who writer, which episode 3 closely resembles. Right down to a quarry passing as an alien planet.
Dan Abnett, Andy Lanning & Mike Perkins: This is the team from Annihilation: Conquest Prologue where Lamentis is first introduced. And never used again until this episode of Loki!
It's probably not a coincidence that in Wandavision, based on comic book logic, the culprit should have been Immortus*, and here it feels like the culprit should be Kang. And probably won't be, because there's nothing in the show's text to suggest it is.
My bet is still that Loki is behind it all. The question is... which Loki?
*people saying it was going to be Mephisto have likely only read half a wikipedia article, and not forced themselves to fully wrap their brains around that awful "Dark Scarlet Witch" storyline from Avengers West Coast.
Did anyone else foresee the final pruning of the episode? The person’s back was facing the other person for a few minutes, it just seemed anticlimactic.
@Matt I think that was because the climax was the scene after the animated credits ran.
Probably. I just thought that moment wasn’t shocking. I was actually expecting a pruning once the collars were deactivated.
The Pruning I think is how the TVA sets variants up to be potential Agents. It's like a mind wipe and reset. So people have been theorizing that there a multiple Morbius, which could be the case. But maybe it's the same Morbius leaving all those drink rings on that table, but he's just been "Pruned" and reset and doesn't remember?
Also Ms Minutes has to be the Boss.
I’m starting to have doubts Kang cameos as the villain. I’m starting to see a trend with villains from WandaVision, F&WS, & Black Widow, which is why the person behind the TVA being Miss Minutes wouldn’t be surprising.
New to the Special Thanks this week:
Mike Gustovich - who had Avengers: The Terminatrix Objective on their list of comics that the MCU would adapt? This is where Alioth is from. 2021 truly is the year of Mark Gruenwald in the MCU. Also definitely opens up another candidate for the person behind the curtain.
Christopher Hastings & Langdon Foss are there for the President Loki visuals from Vote Loki.
Tom King is also there for Vote Loki, as it was his original premise.
Some nice little easter eggs in this one. Tying in the Philadephia Experiment was *chef's kiss*!
I loved all the reaction cuts to Alligator Loki through the episode, really drove home that he was a Loki as much as any of the other Lokis.
And just how much fun Richard E Grant and DeObia Oparei were having portraying their Lokis really came across on the screen. Watching actors have fun acting is the best.
Although I liked seeing the elder Loki & his story, I feel like the series peaked several episodes ago. It could also be that I’m hoping for Kang to appear and getting the feeling that’s not going to be the case.
Cool that Kang is brought in, I thought it was almost a Mandarin choice from Iron Man 3 made until he mentioned that the other Variant is the "Conqueror" one.
This series feels more connected to WandaVision than Falcon did. Just really setting up the Multiverse as the next big MCU event. I'm interested in a Season 2, but I'm not sure where they go from here?
I had to check who the actor was before I knew the character. I kept waiting for a twist. Not sure I care for the interpretation; a bit eccentric. Hopefully future appearance are more in line with the character.
@Mihawk I'm guessing that because Renslayer leaves the TVA before Sylvie kills He Who Remains, in season 2 she'll also remember the original TVA timeline alongside Loki & Sylvie.
So they can potentially flip the alliances from the first season in the second.
Not sure how much of season 2 they've already got in the can given that there were scenes in the season 1 trailer we never saw.
I can see them making the Kang we saw in this episode the Immortus version? The castle is actually interesting. Like why a castle in the first place? Why build statues of the Time Lord's there whenever your the only one that will ever see them?
Did they actually exist and Kang took over?
And what I got from the very ending, is this time the Conqueror version of Kang won the Multiverse War.
@Mihawk not only why build statues of the time keepers? But why build statues of FOUR time keepers and knock one over?
Sorry wrong thread. Unfortunately I have nothing to add to the Loki conversation because I haven't watched a single episode yet