Eeeeeeeewwwwww! [Spoilers]

WetRats

This creeps me out.



Both the concept and the art.

I didn't like it when Byrne toyed with it years ago.

It worked in Kingdom Come with a widowed Clark, and even then it felt kinda wrong.

It was plain nasty in DKII.

This nonsense should stay in the realms of fanfic and XXX "parodies".

Bleah.

David_D

@WetRats believes Wonder Woman has cooties ;)

Planeis

I'm a fan of the idea. Don't really love the cover. But it's fine.

The guys gotta have some romance and since it seems to me almost the whole reason for the reboot was to get rid of the marriage and re-start Superman they might as well do something new.

And stick with it! Don't just do this one time thing for sales!

WetRats

David_D said:

@WetRats believes Wonder Woman has cooties ;)

Nah. She's fine. It's that alien freak who's sketchy.

Greg

I don't like it either. The idea of WW shacking up with any of the other Leaguers always seemed creepy to me. Unless it was ....nevermind....nevermind.

BlackUmbrella

She looks like she hates it. It's a very uncomfortable-looking drawing, IMHO.

WetRats

BlackUmbrella said:

She looks like she hates it. It's a very uncomfortable-looking drawing, IMHO.

Yep.

Typical stiff*, lifeless, over-posed Jim Lee.



*Don't go there.

[Deleted User]

--- WARNING: NEGATIVITY! ----

Sigh... again with the reboot idiocy...

The core concept of Superman (dating back to '38) includes that Lois loves Superman, and Kal El loves Lois. There is a love triangle between 2 people. SUCH a great concept, but it is predicated on the idea that Superman is of singular mind that Lois is the one for him. He is SUPERHUMANLY focused on her, and loyal to her. It plays to a fairy tale-like notion of love, that we all have a soulmate and are destined to be with them.

And don't give me that BS about they are changing the heroes for the modern age... that concept was as much a fairy tale in 38 as it is now... it's a timeless concept.

I agree that for Clark to hook up with WW in Kingdom Come was right for that story, and was, in fact, integral to the story of Clark finding a place in the world and moving on after Lois' death.

But this? Add it to the pile of Crap.

WetRats

Tonebone said:

The core concept of Superman (dating back to '38) includes that Lois loves Superman, and Kal El loves Lois. There is a love triangle between 2 people. SUCH a great concept, but it is predicated on the idea that Superman is of singular mind that Lois is the one for him. He is SUPERHUMANLY focused on her, and loyal to her. It plays to a fairy tale-like notion of love, that we all have a soulmate and are destined to be with them.

And don't give me that BS about they are changing the heroes for the modern age... that concept was as much a fairy tale in 38 as it is now... it's a timeless concept.

I agree that for Clark to hook up with WW in Kingdom Come was right for that story, and was, in fact, integral to the story of Clark finding a place in the world and moving on after Lois' death.

Nicely put.

Torchsong

I have no problem with it, provided they actually do something with it and two issues later we're reading about how Diana thinks it was all a mistake and there's someone Clark loves more than her and blah de blah. You want to be different? You want to really make this universe matter? Then make.this.shit.stick.

Do NOT go back and have Clark fall for Lois. Do NOT make this a dream sequence. Do NOT make this some super-villain's evil scheme. There's potential to be mined here. You really think Bats is going to trust superheroism's "first couple"? What happens the first time the JL votes and they're on opposite sides? What happens when a bad guy figures out they can get to Supes by going through Wonder Woman?

There's potential here...but right now that potential can go either direction. I'll keep my fingers crossed it turns into something cool, and when I'm a (really) old fart I'll be arguing with kids about how "In my day, Superman married Lois Lane!" and they'll be saying "No! Superman loves Wonder Woman!"

Don't screw this up, DC...

Chuck_Melville

Of course, at this stage we have no idea how this is going to play out or how it will end. For all we know, this romance might not work out, and might only serve to push Superman towards getting together with Lois. Or not. We don't want to make too many assumptions or jump to too many conclusions on the basis of a single promo.

Planeis

Torchsong said:

I have no problem with it, provided they actually do something with it and two issues later we're reading about how Diana thinks it was all a mistake and there's someone Clark loves more than her and blah de blah. You want to be different? You want to really make this universe matter? Then make.this.shit.stick.

Do NOT go back and have Clark fall for Lois. Do NOT make this a dream sequence. Do NOT make this some super-villain's evil scheme. There's potential to be mined here. You really think Bats is going to trust superheroism's "first couple"? What happens the first time the JL votes and they're on opposite sides? What happens when a bad guy figures out they can get to Supes by going through Wonder Woman?

There's potential here...but right now that potential can go either direction. I'll keep my fingers crossed it turns into something cool, and when I'm a (really) old fart I'll be arguing with kids about how "In my day, Superman married Lois Lane!" and they'll be saying "No! Superman loves Wonder Woman!"

Don't screw this up, DC...

I agree wholeheartedly.

A few people are having a little discussion about this on twitter too if anyone wants to join in use the #JLA and you can find me @Planeis on the twitter machine too

Chuck_Melville

Frankly, I don't have any interest in a Superman/Wonder Woman romance. I think his romance with Lois really is an important facet to the character. Besides, as noted elsehwhere here, the romance angle with WW has been done before.

You want to really stir up a lot of interest and go somewhere nobody has ever gone before? Introduce a romance between Superman and Batman. That will make the whole country sit up.

mguy1977

Well a romance between Superman & Wonder Woman has been touched on before, Byrne in the early days, an issue of DC Comics Presents (not DCU Presents) & Kingdom Come as examples. I will read the issue of Justice League & give it a read & make a decision YES or NO. In the past I was pro Clark/Lois being married or romantically linked at the very least. This new universe is changing everything on a dime. I honestly don't know that is enough as something better & more exciting in the minds of many comic fans in general rather just stirring up the pot & waiting for the public's reaction-- hot, cold, just right or throw the dang pot out and find Clark a new love interest & start over again w/ someone else.

Matthew (comic marriages they get rebooted or involve a deal w/ the devil to end them, SIGH!)

John_Steed

I made a deal with the devil....

Chuck_Melville

There've been other stories as well. There was one (I forget where it ran) where Superman and WW were trapped in another world and lived out their entire lives there and fell in love. I forget how it resolved other than their eventual return to the point in time where they first left it. (I'll have to check my collection for the details.) Plus there was a four-issue Elsewhere mini-series written by Chris Claremont.

Planeis

OMG. Kurt Busiek just replied to me on twitter about this topic. That means we're practically BEST FRIENDS OMG OMG OMG OMG

David_D

I figure-- sure. Why not? Even if the inevitable is for Clark to end up with Lois (and, to be fair, at this point that is a part of the myth that will get told and retold) then personally I think the two of them getting together means more if there have been other relationships before her. There is plenty of time for Clark to end up with Lois, but in the meantime... why not?

ctowner1

The NUde 52! >:)

e
L nny

David_D

ctowner1 said:

The NUde 52! >:)

e
L nny

He's here all night, folks! ;)

SolitaireRose

That may be one of the worst covers I have ever seen. The two figures don't look like they are in the same drawing, and the placement of the faces looks like horrible photoshop.

Why do people like Jim Lee's art again?

Planeis

SolitaireRose said:

That may be one of the worst covers I have ever seen. The two figures don't look like they are in the same drawing, and the placement of the faces looks like horrible photoshop.

Why do people like Jim Lee's art again?

Exagerration much?

SolitaireRose

Planeis said:

SolitaireRose said:

That may be one of the worst covers I have ever seen. The two figures don't look like they are in the same drawing, and the placement of the faces looks like horrible photoshop.

Why do people like Jim Lee's art again?

Exagerration much?

Nope. Look at the faces...now imagine human faces in that position. You can't, because they wouldn't BE like that. You'd be smashing your cheeks together kind of like when a cat rubs against a chair. I won't even get into how Superman's legs could not be possibly connected to his torso the way he's drawn. He also has done a poor job on Superman's arms, with one having a forearm that seem 1 and 1/2 times as long as it should be, and the other arm just doesn't exist.

Kirby did exaggeration to give a drawing drama and impact. Lee's just shows laziness and the drawing has NO drama or excitement. It's a mess and really looks like he drew Wonder Woman, and then photoshopped a different Superman drawing onto it, stretching and distorting the figure to fit with what had already been drawn.

I know that people like him, and he's very popular, but I just can't get past how his art just doesn't work when you look at it closely. He uses stock figures, stock faces and can't do characters interacting with each other or their environments.

Planeis

Wow. I literally lol'd at how much you dislike him. Never heard anyone say that about him. Liefeld, yes. Lee, no.

Chuck_Melville

I'm not really a Lee fan either, though I wouldn't drop him into the same category as Rob Liefeld. I think Lee's work is detailed and pretty, but definitely on the stiff side and a little cold. I don't quite understand the fan affection for his work either, unless it's an attraction to the detailed prettiness.

Mind you, he's not what I would ever consider a bad artist; there is much worse out there.

DoctorDoom

Greg said:

I don't like it either. The idea of WW shacking up with any of the other Leaguers always seemed creepy to me. Unless it was ....nevermind....nevermind.

Black Canary.

Ohhhhh yeaaaaah.

DoctorDoom

Planeis said:

Wow. I literally lol'd at how much you dislike him. Never heard anyone say that about him. Liefeld, yes. Lee, no.

Different strokes.

People love Howard Chaykin, but I can barely tolerate his art.

And I'm no fan of Kirby's art, either.

SolitaireRose

Planeis said:

Wow. I literally lol'd at how much you dislike him. Never heard anyone say that about him. Liefeld, yes. Lee, no.

Among fans who value storytelling, Lee has pretty much always been disliked, and on a number of discussion groups populated by people who study the art form, he's used as an example of WHY comics are hard to read and how the art of storytelling went away in the 90's.

He's an illustrator, not a storyteller, and I don't care for his illustrations. You want an example of why I dislike him, look at his Batman and Superman covers when he did his 12 issue runs...he drew Superman and Batman almost exactly the same, same facial features, same pose, and only the background and costume were different.

Chuck_Melville

SolitaireRose said:

Planeis said:

Wow. I literally lol'd at how much you dislike him. Never heard anyone say that about him. Liefeld, yes. Lee, no.

Among fans who value storytelling, Lee has pretty much always been disliked, and on a number of discussion groups populated by people who study the art form, he's used as an example of WHY comics are hard to read and how the art of storytelling went away in the 90's.

He's an illustrator, not a storyteller, and I don't care for his illustrations. You want an example of why I dislike him, look at his Batman and Superman covers when he did his 12 issue runs...he drew Superman and Batman almost exactly the same, same facial features, same pose, and only the background and costume were different.

Boy, do I remember those. I bought the entire 12-issue Hush storyline and was greatly disappointed by it, both story and art. I didn't even bother with the Superman story.

batlaw

I have littel problem with Lees art and dont hate this cover (other than the new character designs of course). I also dont mind teasing the idea of a Superman Wonder Woman relationship. Ive always enjoyed that idea but agree here and now its just another uninspired temp gimick that means nothing. Since Ive lost so much interest in this DCU I cant bring myself to really care what they do or be surprised at this point. Nothing in this DCnU matters or means anything... its just pretend lol.

CaptShazam

I do not like the idea of a Superman/Wonder Woman relationship and I should be upset about it but I just cannot bring myself to it. The New 52 has destroyed most of the DC Universe history and the core concepts that go along with it. If they want to take things in a new direction, I hope that the story that goes with it is at least good and that they stick with it...at least until the next reboot.