Fredzilla, hear, hear on the Black Hammer stories! Lemire is building his own parallel universe - histories included! - and you can tell he's had these ideas and storylines kicking around for some time. Just finished Sherlock Frankenstein and it was fantastic. More pure "fun" than Black Hammer itself. (I would think Adam would particularly enjoy its focus on villains.) And yes, I'd be very interested in hearing what Shane and the entire CGS team thinks about Doctor Star given their well known love for a certain comic. I'm loving it but I do wonder at times if the doppelgängers follow their inspirations a little too recognizably (esp with the Liberty Squadron). At times I feel the same way I felt listening to The Beastie Boys' Paul's Boutique where I'm loving the mixing of hundreds of old samples into something different and original, but the "samples" themselves are at times so recognizable I wonder if a fee should be paid for them.
Fortunately comics already have a long history of companies creating their own same-but-different versions of what's come before.
At times I feel the same way I felt listening to The Beastie Boys' Paul's Boutique where I'm loving the mixing of hundreds of old samples into something different and original, but the "samples" themselves are at times so recognizable I wonder if a fee should be paid for them.
Fun fact: Most (not all) of the samples on that album were cleared legally. They paid out a quarter of a million bucks in licensing fees at a time when such fees were much lower than they are today.
Fredzilla, hear, hear on the Black Hammer stories! Lemire is building his own parallel universe - histories included! - and you can tell he's had these ideas and storylines kicking around for some time. Just finished Sherlock Frankenstein and it was fantastic. More pure "fun" than Black Hammer itself. (I would think Adam would particularly enjoy its focus on villains.) And yes, I'd be very interested in hearing what Shane and the entire CGS team thinks about Doctr Star given their well known love for a certain comic. I'm loving it but I do wonder at times if the doppelgängers follow their inspirations a little too recognizably (esp with the Liberty Squadron). At times I feel the same way I felt listening to The Beastie Boys' Paul's Boutique where I'm loving the mixing of hundreds of old samples into something different and original, but the "samples" themselves are at times so recognizable I wonder if a fee should be paid for them.
Fortunately comics already have a long history of companies creating their own same-but-different versions of what's come before.
I have read the first two trades of Black Hammer, and I look forward to reading more, and all the related minis. So I can only speak about that, and analogue characters in general, not about Doctor Star specifically.
For me, there is a long history in comics, and other literature, of making things with the thinly-veiled versions of characters created by others. I don't mind it, and as long as your intent is to make something new and fresh with them, than as a reader you are still getting something new. I found that to be the case with Black Hammer, Squadron Supreme, Watchmen, and the many other things that began in a place of analogue, and then told an entirely new story.
No comparison between mediums is ever perfect, but I would say I don't see the idea of music sampling as equivalent. While some would argue that those samples are tools being used to make something new (and they are, and many use them brilliantly, and I think it is the right thing to do when they pay their royalties for it) putting a sample into your song is not just taking inspiration from someone else's work. Or making an analogue of what someone else did and telling a new story with it. Sampling is actually putting someone else's performance, their work itself, into your work.
I think for the sample comparison to really feel equivalent, Lemire and Fiumara would have to have actually cut panels of Starman into their story. To take not only the idea of a character, but the performance of that character- the art and writing- and make it part of their thing. And I didn't read it, but I doubt that their level of reference got to that point.
Nweathington, from what I've read about the album, the Beasties paid about a quarter million for some of the samples (presumably the most overt that even by late 80's standards wouldve required clearance). However, I don't know if that constitutes "most" since according to the albums engineer "95%" of the album is samples. I've also read that the album contains up to 300 samples and (frequently) read that the album would be virtually impossible to make now because of the amounts they'd have to pay in a legal system that's - for lack of a better phrase - "caught up" with the kind of sampling they were doing. The authors of the book Creative License: The Law and Culture of Digital Sampling estimate that they would have to pay $19.8 million dollars for the samples on that album now, a far cry from the $250K they paid. If you have a link to an article citing that they legally cleared (before the lawsuits) or paid for most of the samples on the album I'd be curious to see it.
Nweathington, from what I've read about the album, the Beasties paid about a quarter million for some of the samples (presumably the most overt that even by late 80's standards wouldve required clearance). However, I don't know if that constitutes "most" since according to the albums engineer "95%" of the album is samples. I've also read that the album contains up to 300 samples and (frequently) read that the album would be virtually impossible to make now because of the amounts they'd have to pay in a legal system that's - for lack of a better phrase - "caught up" with the kind of sampling they were doing. The authors of the book Creative License: The Law and Culture of Digital Sampling estimate that they would have to pay $19.8 million dollars for the samples on that album now, a far cry from the $250K they paid. If you have a link to an article citing that they legally cleared (before the lawsuits) or paid for most of the samples on the album I'd be curious to see it.
As a musician myself, I used to be vehemently opposed to any type of sampling, but I've softened on that stance over the years. I think the litigation and licensing fees have gotten completely out of hand.
Been doing some beach reading this weekend, catching up on some trades and OGNs that have been piling up. First up was the two most recent Dark Horse translations of Blacksad, A Silent Hell and Amarillo. Neither was quite as good as the first couple of volumes, but they were gorgeous to look at and certainly enjoyable enough to read. I particularly liked the New Orleans setting and jazz backdrop of A Silent Hell, though the time-jumping of the storytelling made for a somewhat disjointed reading experience. I give them both a B+.
Next was the second volume of Jerome K. Jerome Bloche, the first of which I discussed earlier in this thread. It's a really fun series, and this second book is every bit as good as the first. I didn't see as much of a jump in the quality of the artwork (which is still quite good) as I expected, but the writing felt smoother and more polished. Recommended for anyone who likes a quirky detective story. This one gets an A-.
Next up was the first two trades of Jason Aaron's Thor: God of Thunder series. I've heard so many great things about the series, but this first story didn't really live up to the hype for me. I thought it was good with some cool moments, but overall not a great story. I had problems with the villain, the God Butcher, but I liked the concept of telling the story in three different time periods with a Thor (or rather three Thors) who's grown over that time. Both volumes get solid B's.
Next up is one from a few years back that I found cheap at a show last year, Human Target: The Final Cut. I've always liked the character and concept of Christopher Chance, even as a kid reading his backup stories in Brave & the Bold, and I'm also a big fan of Javier Pulido's work. And it's written by Peter Milligan, whose work I usually enjoy. I'm not sure why I didn't pick this up sooner. I think it was because I didn't like the miniseries which preceded this OGN all that much. Anyway, I'm glad I finally did. It's one of Milligan's better stories, and Pulido's artwork is top-notch here.
Milligan's take on Chance is that of a man who so buries himself in a role that he is in danger of losing his own identity. It's a great concept for the character, and Milligan handles it very well, setting it in Hollywood where even the cops want to be actors.
I picked up most of the ongoing series which followed this story from some bargain bins for reference back when I was working on my Cliff Chiang book. Now I want to find the Pulido-drawn issues I'm missing and read the whole thing. I give the book a solid A.
Nweathington, interesting article, thanks. What I find ironic is that Pauls Boutique gets so much legal attention for sampling since there was so much of it going on, but to me (and I'm not a musician) the sampling happening on License to Ill seemed more egregious since it has songs built around only one very noticeable sample. I'm thinking specifically of Rhyming and Stealing which is built entirely on the drums from Zeppelin's "When the Levee Breaks". It was a crazy sampling time in rap music back then. So many classic rap albums are built entirely on samples (which is arguably karmically apropos given the white artists in the 50s who made a bundle off songs from early black artists, I suppose).
David D, yeah I would agree the sampling metaphor isn't an equivalent one and that there's a long history of analogues in comics. I was always amused by the case of Watchmen (leave it up to Alan Moore) which is - in a sense - the inverse of what usually happens in cases of "stealing", copyright infringement, or "sampling". (Although I see your point in using it as an example of course.) From my understanding of what happened in that case, DC owned the characters outright and Alan Moore was instructed to use them, but his plans for them were so not what DC wanted for these new characters they'd purchased, that he had to make them into something else.
Next up is volume two of Head Lopper. I really love this series. It's so fun. MacLean's pacing and storytelling are completely on point as usual. It gets a solid A.
David D, yeah I would agree the sampling metaphor isn't an equivalent one and that there's a long history of analogues in comics. I was always amused by the case of Watchmen (leave it up to Alan Moore) which is - in a sense - the inverse of what usually happens in cases of "stealing", copyright infringement, or "sampling". (Although I see your point in using it as an example of course.) From my understanding of what happened in that case, DC owned the characters outright and Alan Moore was instructed to use them, but his plans for them were so not what DC wanted for these new characters they'd purchased, that he had to make them into something else.
I take your point. I was coming at it not from the point of view of the legal liability definition of stealing, the 'does this owe royalties?' question because, as you rightly point out, Moore and Gibbons were starting off with the Charlton characters that DC already owned. So Watchmen would not be a good example of that concern. I see where you are coming from.
I guess I was coming at it more from the point of view of whether or not using analogue characters, even ones that very closely resemble the original, as it sounds like Doctor Star does, lessens the narrative value or impact of a work. (I don't think it does). But I see where you are coming from that this was more of a 'do they owe a fee' question than a quality question.
Looks like I saved the best of the books I brought for last. The Adventures of Dieter Lumpen is a collection of all the Dieter Lumpen short stories and graphic novels that were produced by the team of Jorge Zentner and Ruben Pellejero, presented in English for the first time. It covers a ten-year span of award-winning work (1985-94), and it is truly wonderful to behold. The stories are fun adventures of a reluctant not-quite-a-hero. There's usually a beautiful woman or two involved, but the settings literally take the reader around the world, and are exquisitely rendered by Pellejero.
And, really, Pellejero's artwork is the star of this show. It reminds me a bit of Alex Toth's work for Standard in the '50s. For a modern comparison, he's somewhere between Tim Sale and Marcos Martin. His panel compositions are right up there with Toth and Al Williamson. And the coloring... outstanding. It's not only beautiful in its own right, but it perfectly complements the storytelling, making the story easier to follow and adding to the emotional impact of each scene.
David D, I agree. I certainly hope I didn't give you the impression that I thought using analogues lessens the artistic value of anything since I love what Lemire is doing and - as a big fan of Moore - frequently love analogue stories!
Interestingly, I just finished reading the first 7 issues of Lemire's Frankenstein, Agent of SHADE (part of the New 52) and I loved that too, especially issue 7 which - much to my pleasant surprise - has a very clever analogue for Dr. Manhattan! The character's called Colonel Quantum and he's basically what would have happened if Manhattan had become disillusioned by the War, gone AWOL and stayed behind in the jungle, a la Apocalypse Now's Kurtz. When SHADE finds his "energy signature" decades later, Frankenstein notes that they "initially thought it was Captain Atom" which put a massive grin on this geek's face.
Lemire's Frankenstein is highly recommended if you haven't tried it. The artwork by Alberto Ponticelli is also stunning IMO.
I've had a pretty good shipment so far this month:
Blackwood #1, 2: Strong buy. A story about a school that specializes in the occult. Something strange is going on with the dean and a few new students get pushed into the middle of a mystery. A little Harry Potter, a little haunted house, this is one that I can say: buy, buy, buy.
Pumpkinhead #5: I know, I know, a comic about a fairly cheesy 80s horror film. But being from Dynamite it's done with more class than is typical in these sort of adaptations. I'm not sure if it had any relation to any of the films or not. It did make me want to rewatch the original though. I'm interested in future series, if they do them.
Incognegro Renaissance #5: Buy, buy, buy! A fantastic conclusion to a wonderful noir tale, set in Harlem.
Superman #1: A solid start. I had some difficulty having not read all of the Man of Steel miniseries (i'll catch up in the trade) but I think I'm going to like this run a lot. I hope it doesn't require me getting Action Comics as well though.
Dipped my toe back into Marvel's Captain Marvel title with Life of... and surprisingly enjoyed it. Always a fan of Carlos Pacheco but felt like he was doing shorthand with his art for awhile. This series brought his style back home more or less and the flashback sequences by Marguerite Sauvage were also strong. Reading reviews, it seems as if this version of Carol Danvers fits along with the Brian Reed and later writers version of the character.
The movie synergy feels strong throughout however - especially with the ending pages. Not so much in the likeness - just that it feels like they are using this mini to give the movie a basis for adaptation. Similar to how I felt when I read Green Arrow Year One years after the Arrow TV show started. Even though the mini came long before it, I can see how they mined the mini for the TV show. Probably will do the same with Life of... but in a much more coordinated way.
Golosseum - It's a political satire meets wrestling comic! And it's flippin' brilliant! A strange technology makes people immune to convention weapons, forcing everyone to return to hand-to-hand combat to settle their differences. Russian President Vladimir Putinov (yes...exactly what you're thinking) pits his new super-powered soldiers against all comers (including a very Hulk Hogan-esque representative for America, brutha!). This sucker is well-drawn, well-translated, and frickin' hilarious and fun at the same time. I'm in for the long haul.
I picked this up digitally on @Torchsong 's suggestion. Boy it was nuts and I really liked it. Golosseum is not for the faint of heart because they choose dudes in half fist of the Northstar style. However it's a fun mixture of wrestling, politics, mystery, and brutality.
Just finished the first issue of Black Widow vol. 1, by Waid and Samnee. The good news is that I read it in about two minutes. The better news is that I can read it several more times in the time it would have taken me to read an average book. Not a lot of dialogue in this one, but man, was it action packed! I'm looking forward to the other 100 pages and then volume 2!
Iron Man issues 115-121 (omnibus) Boy a lot of stuff happened in just a few issues. This is very early JRJr with Bob Layton finishes. I do enjoy reading pre tpb comics of this era.
Iron Man issues 115-121 (omnibus) Boy a lot of stuff happened in just a few issues. This is very early JRJr with Bob Layton finishes. I do enjoy reading pre tpb comics of this era.
Michelinie & Layton were hastily modernising the character who was still stuck in a 50's comic - fighting external threats (aliens, communist countries) instead of internal threats (illegal government interventions, industrial espionage, greedy oil companies, alcoholism).
It's a testament to their work that their version is such an influence on both the movie Iron Man AND Ant-Man.
Iron Man issues 115-121 (omnibus) Boy a lot of stuff happened in just a few issues. This is very early JRJr with Bob Layton finishes. I do enjoy reading pre tpb comics of this era.
Michelinie & Layton were hastily modernising the character who was still stuck in a 50's comic - fighting external threats (aliens, communist countries) instead of internal threats (illegal government interventions, industrial espionage, greedy oil companies, alcoholism).
It's a testament to their work that their version is such an influence on both the movie Iron Man AND Ant-Man.
They start off with rogue Shield agents trying to assassinate Tony and then learn Shield has been quietly buying up Stark International stock.
And I love Roxxon. There needs to be more Roxxon in current marvel.
Iron Man issues 115-121 (omnibus) Boy a lot of stuff happened in just a few issues. This is very early JRJr with Bob Layton finishes. I do enjoy reading pre tpb comics of this era.
Michelinie & Layton were hastily modernising the character who was still stuck in a 50's comic - fighting external threats (aliens, communist countries) instead of internal threats (illegal government interventions, industrial espionage, greedy oil companies, alcoholism).
It's a testament to their work that their version is such an influence on both the movie Iron Man AND Ant-Man.
They start off with rogue Shield agents trying to assassinate Tony and then learn Shield has been quietly buying up Stark International stock.
And I love Roxxon. There needs to be more Roxxon in current marvel.
They are currently the antagonists in Weapon H and have been featured heavily in Aaron's Thor, where they are part of Malekith's Dark Council.
Continuing with the Iron Man Omnibus Iron Man 122-130. This covers most of Demon in a bottle story. The entire Omnibus has been leading up to issues 128 & 129 (Tony's drinking slowly increasing, sheild, armor malfunctions). The best parts of the issues I read: drunk Iron Man unleashing chlorine gas on a small town in NY, Justin Hammer, Jarvis getting tired of drunk Tony, Nick Fury vs. Sober Tony, and Iron Man killing a diplomat. Issue 128 (the Demon in a Bottle issue) wasn't great. It wrapped up Tony's drinking problem a little too neatly but I really didn't want to read a year of issues of Tony in AA. So far Layton and Micheline'srun has been really good (the super villians have a little too D team, but they all can't be Doom), and has held up well.
My Hero Academia Chapters 184-192 Great arc focusing on Endeavour as he learns to handle the role of number one hero in a trial by fire (pun intended).
For a character who's been presented as emotionally abusive in the past, author Kohei Horikoshi does a good job of making him sympathetic in his attempts to be better, without letting him off the hook for his past decisions.
We also get introduced to the new number 2 hero Hawks and his unique mission. Which almost feels like a setup for a spin-off along the lines of Ed Brubaker's Sleeper.
Just finished Highest House #6, the end of Part 1 (Yay! There’s more to come!), and it continues to be the best book I’ve read this year. I have no idea when Part 2 will begin, but I can hardly wait. The bad news for Tom King, I'm going to have to nominate Mike Carey for Best Writer come January. The good news for Tom, though, is that because Highest House will be continuing, it will (most likely) get my vote for Best Ongoing Comic (among other categories), so Mister Miracle can still get my Best Limited Series nomination. :)
Comments
Fortunately comics already have a long history of companies creating their own same-but-different versions of what's come before.
For me, there is a long history in comics, and other literature, of making things with the thinly-veiled versions of characters created by others. I don't mind it, and as long as your intent is to make something new and fresh with them, than as a reader you are still getting something new. I found that to be the case with Black Hammer, Squadron Supreme, Watchmen, and the many other things that began in a place of analogue, and then told an entirely new story.
No comparison between mediums is ever perfect, but I would say I don't see the idea of music sampling as equivalent. While some would argue that those samples are tools being used to make something new (and they are, and many use them brilliantly, and I think it is the right thing to do when they pay their royalties for it) putting a sample into your song is not just taking inspiration from someone else's work. Or making an analogue of what someone else did and telling a new story with it. Sampling is actually putting someone else's performance, their work itself, into your work.
I think for the sample comparison to really feel equivalent, Lemire and Fiumara would have to have actually cut panels of Starman into their story. To take not only the idea of a character, but the performance of that character- the art and writing- and make it part of their thing. And I didn't read it, but I doubt that their level of reference got to that point.
As a musician myself, I used to be vehemently opposed to any type of sampling, but I've softened on that stance over the years. I think the litigation and licensing fees have gotten completely out of hand.
Next was the second volume of Jerome K. Jerome Bloche, the first of which I discussed earlier in this thread. It's a really fun series, and this second book is every bit as good as the first. I didn't see as much of a jump in the quality of the artwork (which is still quite good) as I expected, but the writing felt smoother and more polished. Recommended for anyone who likes a quirky detective story. This one gets an A-.
Milligan's take on Chance is that of a man who so buries himself in a role that he is in danger of losing his own identity. It's a great concept for the character, and Milligan handles it very well, setting it in Hollywood where even the cops want to be actors.
I picked up most of the ongoing series which followed this story from some bargain bins for reference back when I was working on my Cliff Chiang book. Now I want to find the Pulido-drawn issues I'm missing and read the whole thing. I give the book a solid A.
I guess I was coming at it more from the point of view of whether or not using analogue characters, even ones that very closely resemble the original, as it sounds like Doctor Star does, lessens the narrative value or impact of a work. (I don't think it does). But I see where you are coming from that this was more of a 'do they owe a fee' question than a quality question.
And, really, Pellejero's artwork is the star of this show. It reminds me a bit of Alex Toth's work for Standard in the '50s. For a modern comparison, he's somewhere between Tim Sale and Marcos Martin. His panel compositions are right up there with Toth and Al Williamson. And the coloring... outstanding. It's not only beautiful in its own right, but it perfectly complements the storytelling, making the story easier to follow and adding to the emotional impact of each scene.
I give this book my highest recommendation. A+.
Interestingly, I just finished reading the first 7 issues of Lemire's Frankenstein, Agent of SHADE (part of the New 52) and I loved that too, especially issue 7 which - much to my pleasant surprise - has a very clever analogue for Dr. Manhattan! The character's called Colonel Quantum and he's basically what would have happened if Manhattan had become disillusioned by the War, gone AWOL and stayed behind in the jungle, a la Apocalypse Now's Kurtz. When SHADE finds his "energy signature" decades later, Frankenstein notes that they "initially thought it was Captain Atom" which put a massive grin on this geek's face.
Lemire's Frankenstein is highly recommended if you haven't tried it. The artwork by Alberto Ponticelli is also stunning IMO.
Blackwood #1, 2: Strong buy. A story about a school that specializes in the occult. Something strange is going on with the dean and a few new students get pushed into the middle of a mystery. A little Harry Potter, a little haunted house, this is one that I can say: buy, buy, buy.
Pumpkinhead #5: I know, I know, a comic about a fairly cheesy 80s horror film. But being from Dynamite it's done with more class than is typical in these sort of adaptations. I'm not sure if it had any relation to any of the films or not. It did make me want to rewatch the original though. I'm interested in future series, if they do them.
Incognegro Renaissance #5: Buy, buy, buy! A fantastic conclusion to a wonderful noir tale, set in Harlem.
Superman #1: A solid start. I had some difficulty having not read all of the Man of Steel miniseries (i'll catch up in the trade) but I think I'm going to like this run a lot. I hope it doesn't require me getting Action Comics as well though.
The movie synergy feels strong throughout however - especially with the ending pages. Not so much in the likeness - just that it feels like they are using this mini to give the movie a basis for adaptation. Similar to how I felt when I read Green Arrow Year One years after the Arrow TV show started. Even though the mini came long before it, I can see how they mined the mini for the TV show. Probably will do the same with Life of... but in a much more coordinated way.
I'll keep reading it.
I went into it knowing they are taking a year long “intermission” (and I’m bummed, it’s my favorite, but whatever it takes to keep the quality high).
I won’t say anything about it except that I thought it was beautiful storytelling. And I think *I* need an intermission after that one.
Boy a lot of stuff happened in just a few issues. This is very early JRJr with Bob Layton finishes. I do enjoy reading pre tpb comics of this era.
It's a testament to their work that their version is such an influence on both the movie Iron Man AND Ant-Man.
And I love Roxxon. There needs to be more Roxxon in current marvel.
Marvel Two in One. Is it wrong for me to prefer Ben over the Thing?
Iron Man 122-130.
This covers most of Demon in a bottle story. The entire Omnibus has been leading up to issues 128 & 129 (Tony's drinking slowly increasing, sheild, armor malfunctions). The best parts of the issues I read: drunk Iron Man unleashing chlorine gas on a small town in NY, Justin Hammer, Jarvis getting tired of drunk Tony, Nick Fury vs. Sober Tony, and Iron Man killing a diplomat.
Issue 128 (the Demon in a Bottle issue) wasn't great. It wrapped up Tony's drinking problem a little too neatly but I really didn't want to read a year of issues of Tony in AA.
So far Layton and Micheline'srun has been really good (the super villians have a little too D team, but they all can't be Doom), and has held up well.
For a character who's been presented as emotionally abusive in the past, author Kohei Horikoshi does a good job of making him sympathetic in his attempts to be better, without letting him off the hook for his past decisions.
We also get introduced to the new number 2 hero Hawks and his unique mission. Which almost feels like a setup for a spin-off along the lines of Ed Brubaker's Sleeper.