OK but PEDs are a violation of the rules so obviously that's cheating. And if video taping is against the rules then that's a violation and also cheating right?
I just didn't understand where you were trying to differentiate the terms rule violation and cheating.
Picking up a player that played for the tea you're playing might be shady but not against any rules. The Broncos already had Welker so there was probably already an advantage, but the Pats had a former Bronco on their team (I think I heard the announcer say that but I don't remember the player's name)
I would say cheating is a violations of the rules, but not every violation is cheating. A helmet-to-helmet hit is an illegal hit and a violation of the rules, but the player is not labeled 'a cheater' when he is fined by NFL.
I wouldn't say fudging the budget to compensate for the salary cap, like what the Broncos did in the late 80s for Elway and another player, is cheating...just is violating the rules.
Growing up, when my parents told me I was no longer allowed to drive their car without their permission and I did anyway, I wasn't cheating...just not obeying the rules.
If the videotape footage was being reviewed during the game or during halftime to adjust the in-game play, then I would definitely say it's a violation of the rules AND cheating. The team was not found to have been doing both.
I do not know what recently signed Pats player was formerly a Bronco. I know McDaniels was a former coach and Austin Collie was a WR that played with Peyton during his Colts days.
Maybe it was Collie, which wouldn't be that much different than being a Broncos player. If you've ever heard Dan Patrick interview Tony Dungy every once in a while he'll ask what Peyton was doing in a situation, as a Bronco, and Dungy gets really closed off about it and won't discuss it so it leads me to believe that Collie would have a lot of inside info about Peyton as well.
If helmet to helmet is done on purpose I would still call it cheating you're taking a shortcut to take a guy out of the game to give your team the advantage.
Messing with the budget to get one of the best QB's would be cheating too, it's doing something against the rules to give your team an unfair advantage.
The parents car thing wouldn't be cheating because you're not necessarily competing in a sport, unless you were taking their car to go drag racing and all the other racers were bound by the rule that to get their parents car they had to have permission, then it would be cheating.
I guess I just see it differently, it's probably just splitting hairs. The Bears dropped the ball (or more accurately failed to stop the run) so I don't have anything else to do but nit pick.
To Sherman's credit, he subsequently issued an apology that seemed genuine and sincere. While I found his initial comments arrogant and cocky, cockiness and arrogance on his part in no way warranted the subsequent deluge of vile comments directed at his ethnicity and race. While my opinion of Sherman's initial comments hasn't wavered, as a Niners' fan, I accept his apology, and hope that those who felt the need to reciprocate by assailing his skin color come to grips with the fact that such responses are never justifiable.
To Sherman's credit, he subsequently issued an apology that seemed genuine and sincere. While I found his initial comments arrogant and cocky, cockiness and arrogance on his part in no way warranted the subsequent deluge of vile comments directed at his ethnicity and race. While my opinion of Sherman's initial comments hasn't wavered, as a Niners' fan, I accept his apology, and hope that those who felt the need to reciprocate by assailing his skin color come to grips with the fact that such responses are never justifiable.
Anytime anyone's gender, appearance, or beliefs are attacked instead of the words or deeds, the attacker is ALWAYS the bigger jackass!
Fred, did you have the same reaction I did when the Safety happened? I looked at my wife and said, "Uh oh. It's going to be one of those Super Bowls." I then went to Club MST3K and watched a couple movies.
Exactly (except for the Club MST3K part). I figured I at least could enjoy the commercials but I don't know if it was the game but I thought all--ALL--of the commercials were lame. There were a couple that made me chuckle but for the most part they were "meh". I also think that the "Budweiser feel good" commercials have jumped the shark.
I thought the Budweiser "A Hero's Welcome" was nice. The Radio Shack 80's Called spot (above) was pretty cool. I actually thought the Tim Tebow / T-Mobile one was great, but that feeling mostly kicked in AFTER the Bronco's had completely choked. It seemed funnier then. I also liked the Seinfeld spot and the Hyundai spot ("Dad's Sixth Sense").
None of the Bud Light commercials made me want a Bud Light. And the constant barrage of overpriced celebrities (Arnold Schwarzenegger, Ellen DeGeneres, and Bruce Willis, etc - even the Matrix one fell flat) was excruciating at best.
I'm bias as Pats fan, but there seems to be a lot of ex-football players who've become Peyton ball washers. Last week guys were saying this is a legacy game for Peyton; a win cementing his season & position as the greatest QB. After the loss, those same guys were saying this loss really means nothing.
So, either its a defining legacy or not. The game's outcome shouldn't define the significance of the game.
I'm bias as Pats fan, but there seems to be a lot of ex-football players who've become Peyton ball washers. Last week guys were saying this is a legacy game for Peyton; a win cementing his season & position as the greatest QB. After the loss, those same guys were saying this loss really means nothing.
So, either its a defining legacy or not. The game's outcome shouldn't define the significance of the game.
M
Or, it could just be a game and in, oh let's say, 100 years no one will give a crap anyway. My own take on the this is to use it as a "teaching" moment. While Manning is always very reverential to his team/coaches, at his core he seems to be one of those guys that believes nothing will get done right if he doesn't have a hand in it. He doesn't really trust the players/coaches around him so he takes far to much responsibility/pressure on himself. It gave me an opportunity to tell my youngest that if you're part of something, there are times when you have to trust the parts.
Last week guys were saying this is a legacy game for Peyton; a win cementing his season & position as the greatest QB. After the loss, those same guys were saying this loss really means nothing.
So, either its a defining legacy or not. The game's outcome shouldn't define the significance of the game.
M
I actually agree with some of that. Sometimes (as in this case for Peyton) the game's significance is more important than the outcome (and the outcome does affect his legacy). We can say the same thing about 2008 Superbowl for Brady.
Then in other cases the outcome defines the significance of the game (The Rise of NE and Tom Brady vs. the Rams in 2001). The 2001 Superbowl is an interesting case if the Rams win we look at Kurt Warner's legacy differently (The Rams were in a Bronco like situation).
Last week guys were saying this is a legacy game for Peyton; a win cementing his season & position as the greatest QB. After the loss, those same guys were saying this loss really means nothing.
So, either its a defining legacy or not. The game's outcome shouldn't define the significance of the game.
M
I actually agree with some of that. Sometimes (as in this case for Peyton) the game's significance is more important than the outcome (and the outcome does affect his legacy). We can say the same thing about 2008 Superbowl for Brady.
Then in other cases the outcome defines the significance of the game (The Rise of NE and Tom Brady vs. the Rams in 2001). The 2001 Superbowl is an interesting case if the Rams win we look at Kurt Warner's legacy differently (The Rams were in a Bronco like situation).
My issue is more about the spin of the game for Peyton. Before the game, it was all about how a win would add his face to the Mt. Rushmore of QBs. After the Broncos lost (Peyton's performance assisted with that), the game is being downplayed as nothing. If a win cements him, then a loss should also effect his QB greatness.
The 18-1 season did effect Brady's legacy. With now being 3-2 in Super Bowls, he'll never top Montana as the best of the elite.
Do Superbowl wins still hold the weight for quaterbacks like they used to?. In some cases I can see where that win might be needed, but I'm not sure anymore.
I don't see this game as a strike against Peyton's legacy nor any of Brady's last losses. Marino never had a Superbowl win and is still considered to be one of the all time greats. Kurt Warner has one win and two losses(?), but is he one of the all times greats? He doesn't even come to mind when I think of hall of fame quarterbacks.
I think Super Bowl wins are a big factor, but not THE factor. That'd mean Elisha Manning is an elite QB being 2-0. An elite QB doesn't have/allow a season like the Giants just had.
I think you have to look at everything. Peyton's regular season stats are unmatched. So are his MVPs. Postseason is a different story. If we just considered postseason records & rings, Peyton doesn't fair well. I consider him one of the best of the best QBs because of his whole package...just under Brady after this past Sunday's game.
Comments
I wouldn't say fudging the budget to compensate for the salary cap, like what the Broncos did in the late 80s for Elway and another player, is cheating...just is violating the rules.
Growing up, when my parents told me I was no longer allowed to drive their car without their permission and I did anyway, I wasn't cheating...just not obeying the rules.
If the videotape footage was being reviewed during the game or during halftime to adjust the in-game play, then I would definitely say it's a violation of the rules AND cheating. The team was not found to have been doing both.
I do not know what recently signed Pats player was formerly a Bronco. I know McDaniels was a former coach and Austin Collie was a WR that played with Peyton during his Colts days.
M
If helmet to helmet is done on purpose I would still call it cheating you're taking a shortcut to take a guy out of the game to give your team the advantage.
Messing with the budget to get one of the best QB's would be cheating too, it's doing something against the rules to give your team an unfair advantage.
The parents car thing wouldn't be cheating because you're not necessarily competing in a sport, unless you were taking their car to go drag racing and all the other racers were bound by the rule that to get their parents car they had to have permission, then it would be cheating.
I guess I just see it differently, it's probably just splitting hairs. The Bears dropped the ball (or more accurately failed to stop the run) so I don't have anything else to do but nit pick.
M
...you break a man's clavicle or shiv his windpipe...he don't have voice to gloat or brag to Erin Andrews after the game. :)
/GEAUX SAINTS!...well...next year anyhow...
Bad Lip Reading is back with another volume...
Niners fans, feel free to use it.
Peyton loses: check
Brady taking a huge step over "Peyton's legacy": check
Good game for Pats fans.
M
"Super Bowl story is so bad not even Shia LaBeouf would rip it off." Mark Silvestri For.The.Win.
I then went to Club MST3K and watched a couple movies.
None of the Bud Light commercials made me want a Bud Light. And the constant barrage of overpriced celebrities (Arnold Schwarzenegger, Ellen DeGeneres, and Bruce Willis, etc - even the Matrix one fell flat) was excruciating at best.
So, either its a defining legacy or not. The game's outcome shouldn't define the significance of the game.
M
My own take on the this is to use it as a "teaching" moment. While Manning is always very reverential to his team/coaches, at his core he seems to be one of those guys that believes nothing will get done right if he doesn't have a hand in it. He doesn't really trust the players/coaches around him so he takes far to much responsibility/pressure on himself.
It gave me an opportunity to tell my youngest that if you're part of something, there are times when you have to trust the parts.
:D
Sometimes (as in this case for Peyton) the game's significance is more important than the outcome (and the outcome does affect his legacy). We can say the same thing about 2008 Superbowl for Brady.
Then in other cases the outcome defines the significance of the game (The Rise of NE and Tom Brady vs. the Rams in 2001). The 2001 Superbowl is an interesting case if the Rams win we look at Kurt Warner's legacy differently (The Rams were in a Bronco like situation).
The 18-1 season did effect Brady's legacy. With now being 3-2 in Super Bowls, he'll never top Montana as the best of the elite.
M
I don't see this game as a strike against Peyton's legacy nor any of Brady's last losses. Marino never had a Superbowl win and is still considered to be one of the all time greats. Kurt Warner has one win and two losses(?), but is he one of the all times greats? He doesn't even come to mind when I think of hall of fame quarterbacks.
I think you have to look at everything. Peyton's regular season stats are unmatched. So are his MVPs. Postseason is a different story. If we just considered postseason records & rings, Peyton doesn't fair well. I consider him one of the best of the best QBs because of his whole package...just under Brady after this past Sunday's game.
M