I'm more or less the same, I read them for the "general opinion" of critics, that doesn't mean my opinion will be the same, but there's a greater than 50% chance that it will be at least somewhat close. I certainly watch a movie with an open mind though, I liked BvS more than what the critic opinion was.
One bit of anecdotal data: the local reviewer gave Suicide Squad 1/2 star. That’s right—a half a star out of a possible five. He’s not a huge fan of the superhero films, but he’s usually about half a star lower than my personal ratings. And for contrast, he gave BvS three stars. I thought it funny that one of his biggest complaints was that he felt the movie needed more of the Joker. Maybe that was because he thought the actress playing Enchantress was terrible. The only things he liked about the movie were Viola Davis’ performance, and he thought Robbie was pretty good.
That's one of the reasons I only read reviews for spoilers & never an assessment. I don't care for Shane Kelly chick flix or musicals. Because of that, I'm overly critical of them. I wouldn't want to have opinions generated by fanboy or those who dislike genres.
The guy is also a horror fan and he treats sci-fi with the same respect he does documentaries and classic movies, so he’s not opposed to genre fiction. In fact, he’s quite knowledegable about genre fiction. Superheroes just don't do it for him in general, and that’s fine. Like I said, I know how to adjust for his bias, and he does make legitimate, detailed criticisms, so I like to hear his opinion, even if it may be different than mine.
Excerpt from An Open Letter To Warner Bros CEO Kevin Tsujihara About Layoffs, Zack Snyder, and Donuts
...I wrote this letter last year. I actually started forming it in my head after Man of Steel was a box office failure instead of the modern classic tentpole you were expecting.
I kept holding off on doing anything with it because of one title: Suicide Squad. Zack Snyder's Dawn of Justice was a fiasco, but here comes this plucky little dark adventure about antiheroes. I love David Ayer. I love Harley Quinn. I love Will Smith. Put the letter in a drawer. The ship isn't sinking anymore. Everything is fine. There's no way this movie is bad.
And here we are. I got back from my screening and dusted this sucker off. You, your executive team, and the vision of your 'extraordinary storytellers' that resulted in the loss of around one thousand jobs seem intent on crashing the ship into as much shit as you can find in the ocean by making inane decisions over and over again.
Zack Snyder is not delivering. Is he being punished? Assistants who were doing fantastic work certainly were. People in finance and in marketing and in IT. They had no say in a movie called Batman V Superman only having 8 minutes of Batman fighting Superman in it, that ends because their moms have the same name. Snyder is a producer on every DC movie. He is still directing Justice League. He is being rewarded with more opportunity to get more people laid off. I'm assuming you yourself haven't been financially affected in any real way. You and your studio are the biggest lesson about life one can learn: The top screws up and the bottom suffers. Peter Jackson phones it in and a marketing supervisor has to figure out a plan B for house payments.
Your uneven Hall H presentation at Comic Con this year was a ridiculous mess that ranged from rushed to boring. When Marvel announced their full slate of films with a fun fan event several years ago, you announced yours on a shareholder conference call.
You just don't get it. And it's not just DC movies, it's your whole slate. Jupiter Ascending. Get Hard. Hot Pursuit. Max. Vacation. Pan. Point Break. F**king PAN, you jerk. People lost their jobs and you decided Pan was a good idea. You think another Jungle Book is a good idea.
What are you even doing? I wish to God you were forced to live out of a car until you made a #1 movie of the year. Maybe Wonder Woman wouldn't be such a mess. Don't try to hide behind the great trailer. People inside are already confirming it's another mess. It is almost impressive how you keep rewarding the same producers and executives for making the same mistakes, over and over.
Excerpt from An Open Letter To Warner Bros CEO Kevin Tsujihara About Layoffs, Zack Snyder, and Donuts
...I wrote this letter last year. I actually started forming it in my head after Man of Steel was a box office failure instead of the modern classic tentpole you were expecting.
I kept holding off on doing anything with it because of one title: Suicide Squad. Zack Snyder's Dawn of Justice was a fiasco, but here comes this plucky little dark adventure about antiheroes. I love David Ayer. I love Harley Quinn. I love Will Smith. Put the letter in a drawer. The ship isn't sinking anymore. Everything is fine. There's no way this movie is bad.
And here we are. I got back from my screening and dusted this sucker off. You, your executive team, and the vision of your 'extraordinary storytellers' that resulted in the loss of around one thousand jobs seem intent on crashing the ship into as much shit as you can find in the ocean by making inane decisions over and over again.
Zack Snyder is not delivering. Is he being punished? Assistants who were doing fantastic work certainly were. People in finance and in marketing and in IT. They had no say in a movie called Batman V Superman only having 8 minutes of Batman fighting Superman in it, that ends because their moms have the same name. Snyder is a producer on every DC movie. He is still directing Justice League. He is being rewarded with more opportunity to get more people laid off. I'm assuming you yourself haven't been financially affected in any real way. You and your studio are the biggest lesson about life one can learn: The top screws up and the bottom suffers. Peter Jackson phones it in and a marketing supervisor has to figure out a plan B for house payments.
Your uneven Hall H presentation at Comic Con this year was a ridiculous mess that ranged from rushed to boring. When Marvel announced their full slate of films with a fun fan event several years ago, you announced yours on a shareholder conference call.
You just don't get it. And it's not just DC movies, it's your whole slate. Jupiter Ascending. Get Hard. Hot Pursuit. Max. Vacation. Pan. Point Break. F**king PAN, you jerk. People lost their jobs and you decided Pan was a good idea. You think another Jungle Book is a good idea.
What are you even doing? I wish to God you were forced to live out of a car until you made a #1 movie of the year. Maybe Wonder Woman wouldn't be such a mess. Don't try to hide behind the great trailer. People inside are already confirming it's another mess. It is almost impressive how you keep rewarding the same producers and executives for making the same mistakes, over and over.
First I've heard of it. Now there are folks that don't like Gadot's nationality or that men wrote the screenplay, but their opinion hardly matters to most.
Still others think critics hate DC movies, so there's that...
I've come to the conclusion that (with two exceptions) I prefer my superheroes on the comic book page, rather than in live action films or TV shows.
It's not to say I think most of the latter are awful; on the contrary, I think most live action superhero adaptations have been mediocre to very good. But these characters play so much better for me when I absorb their exploits in written and illustrated form. Perhaps it's something in their DNA, for me. I can't quite figure it out yet. All I know is, that this pop culture ladder of respectability we seem to have embraced... with live action films being on the very top of importance, then live action cable and streaming TV below that, then live action network TV, then videogames and animated content, then novels, graphic novels, and trades and floppies down below... this ladder perspective doesn't work for me anymore. If I find a comic book I love, or a prose novel, or even an iPhone game, my first thought isn't "this should be a movie! / this deserves to be a movie! / this would be even better as a movie!!!"
I admit, some of my own selfishness is coming into play. Part of my love for comics is that it is still one of the few media I follow which has remained niche, and has not gone mainstream (even if many of its characters have). Most of the people in my family or even my condo building still don't read comic books, and they never will. So when I love a comic, even in this age of the internet? - I can still feel a cozy intimacy with it - like no one else around me knows about this amazing thing. Comic books are still my secret fishing spot.
I also admit: I am now some degree of terrified whenever another comic book movie is due out - particularly ones adapted from comics I love. The two year promo build up, where pop culture must weigh in on *every step of pre-production* during our internet-fueled armchair quarterbacking and micromanaging of anything we like or might like... the brand wars, of how what was once a fun, childish rivalry between DC and Marvel comic book fans has now been weaponized in the Hollywood mainstream, especially by critics, social media, and studios... I mean, I love Wonder Woman, and that trailer looks great, but half of me is already so so so dreading the audience and industry digestion/reaction to it, whether it is good or bad, whether it is a box office success or a failure.
P.S. Those two exceptions I mentioned up top are "Superman: The Movie" and "The Dark Knight" :)
I've come to the conclusion that (with two exceptions) I prefer my superheroes on the comic book page, rather than in live action films or TV shows.
It's not to say I think most of the latter are awful; on the contrary, I think most live action superhero adaptations have been mediocre to very good. But these characters play so much better for me when I absorb their exploits in written and illustrated form. Perhaps it's something in their DNA, for me. I can't quite figure it out yet. All I know is, that this pop culture ladder of respectability we seem to have embraced... with live action films being on the very top of importance, then live action cable and streaming TV below that, then live action network TV, then videogames and animated content, then novels, graphic novels, and trades and floppies down below... this ladder perspective doesn't work for me anymore. If I find a comic book I love, or a prose novel, or even an iPhone game, my first thought isn't "this should be a movie! / this deserves to be a movie! / this would be even better as a movie!!!"
I admit, some of my own selfishness is coming into play. Part of my love for comics is that it is still one of the few media I follow which has remained niche, and has not gone mainstream (even if many of its characters have). Most of the people in my family or even my condo building still don't read comic books, and they never will. So when I love a comic, even in this age of the internet? - I can still feel a cozy intimacy with it - that no one else around me knows about this amazing thing. Comic books are still my secret fishing spot.
I also admit: I am now some degree of terrified whenever another comic book movie is due out - particularly ones adapted from comics I love. The two year promo build up, where pop culture must weigh in on *every step of pre-production* during our internet-fueled armchair quarterbacking and micromanaging of anything we like or might like... the brand wars, of how what was once a fun, childish rivalry between DC and Marvel comic book fans has now been weaponized into the Hollywood mainstream, especially by critics and social media... I mean, I love Wonder Woman, and that trailer looks great, but half of me is already so so so dreading the audience and industry digestion/reaction to it, whether it is good or bad, whether it is a box office success or a failure.
P.S. Those two exceptions I mentioned up top are "Superman: The Movie" and "The Dark Knight" :)
One of us! One of us! One of us!
Welcome to the club, Dave. I’ve felt pretty much the same way since... well, since the mid-’90s. So many people I know are surprised when I tell them I haven’t seen this or that superhero movie. I’ve seen most of the Marvel movies now, but I’ve only seen three in the theater, and that’s because my kids wanted to go. I’ve seen bits and pieces of the X-Men films, but never sat down to watch one from start to finish. I haven’t even seen the second and third Nolan Batman films all the way through. I don’t watch any of the TV shows regularly, outside of the Agent Carter miniseasons.
It’s not that I have anything against them. Most of them I enjoy well enough once I get around to watching them. I just prefer the intimacy and creativity of comics, and the movie versions will never match what I feel when I look at brushstrokes on a page.
1. An editor 2. Better director 3. Someone to tighten up the script 4. Stronger plot. 5. Robbie picking an accent and sticking with it (unless that is part of Harley's craziness) 6. Maybe a villian fleshed out a little more (see #4)
...It was a good movie! I did think overall the acting was good. Will Smith was...Will Smith. Viola Davis was great. Robbie was good.
Spoilers:
The biggest problem I had is that two thirds of the resolution to the conflict really did not require the Squad. A bomb took out "Brother" and a bomb took out the heartless Enchantress. If they would have destroyed the heart when Enchantress first went rogue (which I thought Waller was doing) this could have been dealt with by a couple long range bombs. At least I think. Waller punching/smashing the heart and then it coming back is a bit confusing.
I definitely prefer to read about my favorite superheroes, but I enjoy it when I see them on the big (or small) screen as well...as long as they're done "right" (and "right" here is my definition, not yours...go getcher own! :) )
1) Christian Bale's Batman 2) Affleck's Batman AND Bruce Wayne (he's the only one to get 'em both right in my book) 3) Clooney's Bruce Wayne...rest of the movie was shit but he was great as Bruce. 4) Viola Davis as Waller 5) Reeve's Superman 6) Tennant as the Purple Man. Flippin' brilliant. 7) Romero's Joker 8) Amell's Ollie Queen 9) Benoist as Supergirl 10) Evans as Cap. I was never a huge Cap fan until I saw his movies. He *is* Steve Rogers. I can't imagine anyone else in the role.
...and the list goes on. I'm not gonna list the "bad" examples. There are many, but it's a waste of energy and I'm sure for several of my my "right" examples are your "wrong" examples. Nothing wrong with that.
I think things got a lot easier for me when I stopped worrying about everything being "canon" and everything "counting". Lord knows I've read enough (and enjoyed enough) Elseworld's tales to have room in my head to enjoy both Adam West AND Ben Affleck's portrayals of the Bat.
Based on the box office I think this is a case that the entertainment value far outweighs the quality of the movie. There were decent performances but that was it for me. If you liked it this guarantees you get another movie.
What did you think about the characterization of the Joker?
Is he the type to risk his neck multiple times to save Harley or would he just cut her loose? If she made it back to him on her own, great but if not, he is not going to worry about it.
What did you think about the characterization of the Joker?
Is he the type to risk his neck multiple times to save Harley or would he just cut her loose? If she made it back to him on her own, great but if not, he is not going to worry about it.
To date there hasn't been a version of the Joker I haven't enjoyed (yes, even Leto's).
To me the best Joker/Harley scene came in the New52 during Death of the Family. Paraphrasing/Summarizing heavily, but Joker had Harley set up a trap for Batman that might involve her death/mutilation. She asks him if he'd still find her beautiful, and his response is priceless:
"Oh Harley...when did I ever say I found you beautiful?"
I think Leto's Joker has a genuine affection for Harley, but it borders on a "can't live with her/won't let anyone else live with her" mentality. Really wasn't enough screentime to develop that idea, though. That was just the impression I got.
I generally with this, however, in the specific case of Suicide Squad & The Joker, I going to lay the blame at the studio. How many articles came out before the movie about how intense Leto was, how into the character he was, and how dark the Joker was going to be? When the actual movie came out, there was very little of this.
Fans were a little mislead and they should be somewhat upset. That does not mean death threat type stupidity though.
I generally with this, however, in the specific case of Suicide Squad & The Joker, I going to lay the blame at the studio. How many articles came out before the movie about how intense Leto was, how into the character he was, and how dark the Joker was going to be?
"Suicide Squad" may have had one of the longest sustained PR campaigns in movie marketing history (so far). It seems that movie has been pushed to the forefront for at least two years, making me relieved when it finally opened in theaters and I wouldn't have to look at Leto's and (to a lesser extent) Robbie's maniacally grinning mugs any longer.
I don’t have a problem with people starting a petition. That’s a harmless way of making one’s voice heard. What I have a problem with is when it escalates to bullying and harrassment or worse. That is unacceptable.
I think a lot of the problem lies in social media and conventions. Fans can feel like they know the creators they interact with, even if they’ve never met them. They may even view themselves as stockholders in a way of those creators/comics/TV shows/movie studios. Things like Patreon and Kickstarter certainly add to that. (And creators can use it to their advantage, so it's a two-way street.) I see lots of fans (including many on this forum) throwing out words like disenfranchisement, and investment, which imply a sense of ownership. Back when I worked at a comic shop, some customers would complain about how bad X-Men was, but they kept buying it. I would ask them, “Why do you keep buying it if you hate it so much?” The response would invariably be, “Because that’s my book.” So I think most fans feel some degree of ownership in the things they love, and there’s nothing wrong with that, because there is some small kernel of truth to that. Some people just have a hard time discerning where that line is between fan expectations and creative freedom (and also corporate interest).
Although I have been heavily "invested" in DC Comics for the past 30+ years or so, the only thing I "own" and the only thing they "owe" me are the comic books I have in my boxes or strewn about my room.
No matter how much I love Captain "Shazam" Marvel, any of the Teen Titans, Batman, etc...or how much money I have spent on books and merchandise...my voice in their creation stops with my dollars.
When they put Mary Marvel in a black outfit, made her evil, and totally wrecked her character, I didn't buy the books. Still don't have any of them. That's my voice being heard. I also griped about it online, like any good comic nerd. At no point did I start a petition demanding they change her back, nor sign anything of that nature. Because there were some clueless souls out there who liked Mary that way. :) And they got a vote same way I did...by buying the books.
At the end of the day, a creator only owes you their product.
And you only owe them your patronage, or lack thereof.
Anything beyond that is fluff and entitlement, and I feel sorry that creators are feeling the need to capitulate to them.
* Exception being made for anyone who owns stock in Time/Warner. :)
I think the idea of “investment” is every bit as important, as it implies that one feels they should get a return on the time and money they put into a title, publisher, etc., greater than what they put into it. When you invest in the stock market, you are doing so in order to make a profit. And I think most fans, whether consciously or not, do the same with their entertainment. Sports fans “invest” in a team or athlete in order to share in the joy of defeating a hated rival, and ultimately, the high of winning a championship. Lost fans expected an amazing series finale that would give all the previous episodes more meaning and importance. And the same goes in comics.
I wonder if that’s part of the reason for the death of the anthology books. Maybe because there is relatively little “investment” involved in reading a short story, the payoff doesn’t feel worth the time and money to enough readers.
Well, as a longsuffering New Orleans Saints fan, I *do* feel invested in the team's success and feel the pain when they lose. I was there when the "Bagheads" were in the stands. I was the guy who didn't smile when we actually made the playoffs, because I knew we weren't getting past the wild-card or first round. I could predict when Bobby Hebert was going to throw an interception. During "Bountygate" I was right there with the rest of the faithful calling for Goodell's head on a platter (good-naturedly...I don't make death threats). I will criticize the team when they make a bone-headed decision, praise them when they do well...all the stuff a fan is supposed to do. I buy tickets to games, own several jerseys and have a line of action figures in my office. I'm definitely invested in the team...
...but at no point do I feel I have a right to walk on the field and tell Drew Brees what he needs to do on this next play. I'm pretty sure, nice guy that Drew seems to be, he wouldn't say "Eff off, ya pissant!" but at the same time, I really couldn't expect him to listen to me, either. :)
Well, as a longsuffering New Orleans Saints fan, I *do* feel invested in the team's success and feel the pain when they lose. I was there when the "Bagheads" were in the stands. I was the guy who didn't smile when we actually made the playoffs, because I knew we weren't getting past the wild-card or first round. I could predict when Bobby Hebert was going to throw an interception. During "Bountygate" I was right there with the rest of the faithful calling for Goodell's head on a platter (good-naturedly...I don't make death threats). I will criticize the team when they make a bone-headed decision, praise them when they do well...all the stuff a fan is supposed to do. I buy tickets to games, own several jerseys and have a line of action figures in my office. I'm definitely invested in the team...
...but at no point do I feel I have a right to walk on the field and tell Drew Brees what he needs to do on this next play. I'm pretty sure, nice guy that Drew seems to be, he wouldn't say "Eff off, ya pissant!" but at the same time, I really couldn't expect him to listen to me, either. :)
And then there are the fans who throw batteries at opposing teams’ fans, or giveaway prizes onto the field to show their displeasure.
Comments
There's chatter the WW movie is a mess?
Still others think critics hate DC movies, so there's that...
It's not to say I think most of the latter are awful; on the contrary, I think most live action superhero adaptations have been mediocre to very good. But these characters play so much better for me when I absorb their exploits in written and illustrated form. Perhaps it's something in their DNA, for me. I can't quite figure it out yet. All I know is, that this pop culture ladder of respectability we seem to have embraced... with live action films being on the very top of importance, then live action cable and streaming TV below that, then live action network TV, then videogames and animated content, then novels, graphic novels, and trades and floppies down below... this ladder perspective doesn't work for me anymore. If I find a comic book I love, or a prose novel, or even an iPhone game, my first thought isn't "this should be a movie! / this deserves to be a movie! / this would be even better as a movie!!!"
I admit, some of my own selfishness is coming into play. Part of my love for comics is that it is still one of the few media I follow which has remained niche, and has not gone mainstream (even if many of its characters have). Most of the people in my family or even my condo building still don't read comic books, and they never will. So when I love a comic, even in this age of the internet? - I can still feel a cozy intimacy with it - like no one else around me knows about this amazing thing. Comic books are still my secret fishing spot.
I also admit: I am now some degree of terrified whenever another comic book movie is due out - particularly ones adapted from comics I love. The two year promo build up, where pop culture must weigh in on *every step of pre-production* during our internet-fueled armchair quarterbacking and micromanaging of anything we like or might like... the brand wars, of how what was once a fun, childish rivalry between DC and Marvel comic book fans has now been weaponized in the Hollywood mainstream, especially by critics, social media, and studios... I mean, I love Wonder Woman, and that trailer looks great, but half of me is already so so so dreading the audience and industry digestion/reaction to it, whether it is good or bad, whether it is a box office success or a failure.
P.S. Those two exceptions I mentioned up top are "Superman: The Movie" and "The Dark Knight" :)
Welcome to the club, Dave. I’ve felt pretty much the same way since... well, since the mid-’90s. So many people I know are surprised when I tell them I haven’t seen this or that superhero movie. I’ve seen most of the Marvel movies now, but I’ve only seen three in the theater, and that’s because my kids wanted to go. I’ve seen bits and pieces of the X-Men films, but never sat down to watch one from start to finish. I haven’t even seen the second and third Nolan Batman films all the way through. I don’t watch any of the TV shows regularly, outside of the Agent Carter miniseasons.
It’s not that I have anything against them. Most of them I enjoy well enough once I get around to watching them. I just prefer the intimacy and creativity of comics, and the movie versions will never match what I feel when I look at brushstrokes on a page.
1. An editor
2. Better director
3. Someone to tighten up the script
4. Stronger plot.
5. Robbie picking an accent and sticking with it (unless that is part of Harley's craziness)
6. Maybe a villian fleshed out a little more (see #4)
...It was a good movie! I did think overall the acting was good. Will Smith was...Will Smith. Viola Davis was great. Robbie was good.
Spoilers:
The biggest problem I had is that two thirds of the resolution to the conflict really did not require the Squad. A bomb took out "Brother" and a bomb took out the heartless Enchantress. If they would have destroyed the heart when Enchantress first went rogue (which I thought Waller was doing) this could have been dealt with by a couple long range bombs. At least I think. Waller punching/smashing the heart and then it coming back is a bit confusing.
1) Christian Bale's Batman
2) Affleck's Batman AND Bruce Wayne (he's the only one to get 'em both right in my book)
3) Clooney's Bruce Wayne...rest of the movie was shit but he was great as Bruce.
4) Viola Davis as Waller
5) Reeve's Superman
6) Tennant as the Purple Man. Flippin' brilliant.
7) Romero's Joker
8) Amell's Ollie Queen
9) Benoist as Supergirl
10) Evans as Cap. I was never a huge Cap fan until I saw his movies. He *is* Steve Rogers. I can't imagine anyone else in the role.
...and the list goes on. I'm not gonna list the "bad" examples. There are many, but it's a waste of energy and I'm sure for several of my my "right" examples are your "wrong" examples. Nothing wrong with that.
I think things got a lot easier for me when I stopped worrying about everything being "canon" and everything "counting". Lord knows I've read enough (and enjoyed enough) Elseworld's tales to have room in my head to enjoy both Adam West AND Ben Affleck's portrayals of the Bat.
Is he the type to risk his neck multiple times to save Harley or would he just cut her loose? If she made it back to him on her own, great but if not, he is not going to worry about it.
To me the best Joker/Harley scene came in the New52 during Death of the Family. Paraphrasing/Summarizing heavily, but Joker had Harley set up a trap for Batman that might involve her death/mutilation. She asks him if he'd still find her beautiful, and his response is priceless:
"Oh Harley...when did I ever say I found you beautiful?"
I think Leto's Joker has a genuine affection for Harley, but it borders on a "can't live with her/won't let anyone else live with her" mentality. Really wasn't enough screentime to develop that idea, though. That was just the impression I got.
2) Ledger
3) Hamil
4) Leto
5) Nicholson
https://www.boston.com/culture/celebs/2016/08/16/captain-america-and-falcon-paid-a-visit-to-the-kids-at-mass-general-today
2. Jack
3. Hamil
4. Romero
5. Prince 1/2 Joker in Batdance
6. Prince Joker in Partyman
7. Leto
Oh wait.
Petition #1: We Want A Suicide Squad "Joker" Cut
Petition #2: Suicide Squad Extended Edition
Then there are these gems.
Petition #3: Give Jared Leto's Joker His Own Movie
Petition #4: Reshoot Suicide Squad with Gary Busey as The Joker instead of Jared Leto
Oh the entitlement generation never ceases to amuse me. I think I could get behind that 4th one. :)
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/act-four/wp/2016/08/15/art-is-about-surrender-stop-asking-for-it-to-be-custom-tailored/?utm_term=.1bc2bd5582ef
Fans were a little mislead and they should be somewhat upset. That does not mean death threat type stupidity though.
I think a lot of the problem lies in social media and conventions. Fans can feel like they know the creators they interact with, even if they’ve never met them. They may even view themselves as stockholders in a way of those creators/comics/TV shows/movie studios. Things like Patreon and Kickstarter certainly add to that. (And creators can use it to their advantage, so it's a two-way street.) I see lots of fans (including many on this forum) throwing out words like disenfranchisement, and investment, which imply a sense of ownership. Back when I worked at a comic shop, some customers would complain about how bad X-Men was, but they kept buying it. I would ask them, “Why do you keep buying it if you hate it so much?” The response would invariably be, “Because that’s my book.” So I think most fans feel some degree of ownership in the things they love, and there’s nothing wrong with that, because there is some small kernel of truth to that. Some people just have a hard time discerning where that line is between fan expectations and creative freedom (and also corporate interest).
Although I have been heavily "invested" in DC Comics for the past 30+ years or so, the only thing I "own" and the only thing they "owe" me are the comic books I have in my boxes or strewn about my room.
No matter how much I love Captain "Shazam" Marvel, any of the Teen Titans, Batman, etc...or how much money I have spent on books and merchandise...my voice in their creation stops with my dollars.
When they put Mary Marvel in a black outfit, made her evil, and totally wrecked her character, I didn't buy the books. Still don't have any of them. That's my voice being heard. I also griped about it online, like any good comic nerd. At no point did I start a petition demanding they change her back, nor sign anything of that nature. Because there were some clueless souls out there who liked Mary that way. :) And they got a vote same way I did...by buying the books.
At the end of the day, a creator only owes you their product.
And you only owe them your patronage, or lack thereof.
Anything beyond that is fluff and entitlement, and I feel sorry that creators are feeling the need to capitulate to them.
* Exception being made for anyone who owns stock in Time/Warner. :)
I wonder if that’s part of the reason for the death of the anthology books. Maybe because there is relatively little “investment” involved in reading a short story, the payoff doesn’t feel worth the time and money to enough readers.
...but at no point do I feel I have a right to walk on the field and tell Drew Brees what he needs to do on this next play. I'm pretty sure, nice guy that Drew seems to be, he wouldn't say "Eff off, ya pissant!" but at the same time, I really couldn't expect him to listen to me, either. :)