I'm still of the mind that the FF would work if given the "1st Class" treatment. Set the story/s in the late 50's early 60's and use them to build the MMU. I feel that if you set the FF as contemporaries of the Avengers you have to explain "why".
Why do you need another Super-Team? The MMU is already starting to feel a bit crowded.
Why can't they use the comic book origin? Today, shooting rockets into space is becoming an everyday occurrence. There's no mystery or romance. If the story is set during the beginnings of the cold war you have a motive for the launch and a reason for the hurried preparations. You could even explain away the college professor dating a student and including her little brother on the trip.
I'm still of the mind that the FF would work if given the "1st Class" treatment. Set the story/s in the late 50's early 60's and use them to build the MMU. I feel that if you set the FF as contemporaries of the Avengers you have to explain "why".
Why do you need another Super-Team? The MMU is already starting to feel a bit crowded.
Why can't they use the comic book origin? Today, shooting rockets into space is becoming an everyday occurrence. There's no mystery or romance. If the story is set during the beginnings of the cold war you have a motive for the launch and a reason for the hurried preparations. You could even explain away the college professor dating a student and including her little brother on the trip.
Rant over.
I would disagree. First, I don't find the MCU overcrowded. Sure there are 4 individual franchises, each with supporting characters, 1 franchise that's essentially a stand alone at this point, & the Avengers. Widow, Barton, Banner, Vision, & Maximoff are your utility characters.
I think you could use the rocket into space bit. Maybe it's to decommission a Hammer satellite that was revealed to have (attempted) advanced weaponry to "assist" with protecting the world. Since it's already been established Hammer has wanted the government defense contract & has subpar tech, there'd be a tie in (plus maybe even a Sam Rockwell cameo).
There's really only one "super team" in the MCU right now. Sure you have the GotG, but they appear to be in deep space. The FF could do some space & some Earth based adventures.
I think there's a lot of missed opportunities if the FF, Doom, & crew are the generation before the Avengers.
Plus, I'd love a little nod by a Chris Evans Cap approaching Johnny Storm with "you seem familiar" (which works on 2 fronts if you remember the Human Torch at the Fair in First Avenger).
I think there's a lot of missed opportunities if the FF, Doom, & crew are the generation before the Avengers.
Plus, I'd love a little nod by a Chris Evans Cap approaching Johnny Storm with "you seem familiar" (which works on 2 fronts if you remember the Human Torch at the Fair in First Avenger).
Agreed. Though I'd skip the origin all together, exposition explaining reed's failed attempt to duplicate the chitauri space warp tech, and have them off in their own research facility, away from superheroics. Not known, not unknown. Then I have this whole movie in my head already while observing the multiverse in search of a cure for Ben, he discovers universes where he is present are being destroyed (cue cameo with mcgruffud and teller) and from there it's a combination of Annihilation and Secret Wars.
Apparently he really likes the characters. Though I haven't seen the movie (it seems I'm in the majority) I have been advised its a surprise Kinberg really likes them.
Plus, I read somewhere Mara isn't interested in returning.
M
I think Simon Kinberg has finally figured out that it isn't likely to happen anymore.
He still sounds like he is on the fence, but just because he doesn't exactly walk back his original comments doesn't mean he isn't keenly aware of the economics involved.
Here we are two years later. Wanted to see what everyone else had to say before I started serving out slices of crow and humble pie.
j/k
I believe Disney is looking FAR past the Marvel properties on this one. Once this deal happens, Disney would also own the Avatar franchise (which is already part of Disney’s Animal Kingdom), as well as other IPs such as Alien (which Dark Horse would probably lose too). It could also finally mean the re-issue of the unaltered original Star Wars trilogy (FOX owns distribution rights to 'Episode IV').
Disney wants to start their own Netflix style streaming service, and acquiring the 20th century FOX library and IPs would go a LONG way towards making that a reality. Depending on your perspective, this is a VERY bad thing or a very good thing.
As it stands, Disney currently has an involvement in around 40% of all the films released in 2017. This would increase that percentage.
Re: Whether this deal is connected to the rumor that an FF deal was made in October of 2015, and if the current news connects to those old rumors, Bloomberg describes the curent talks between Fox and Disney this way:
"The talks between Disney and Fox, which began more than two months ago, will unite two giants of the entertainment industry. . ."
So these talks are about Disney buying a stake in Fox assets, and have lasted only for a little more than two months.
The rumor going in the fall of 2015 was about some sort of swap of FF for X-Men rights, so that there could be an FF film in 2020. I consider those rumors still debunked, and tje studio denials back then proved true. This potential coming deal is a different and bigger thing, as @bralinator also explained above, and at a much later time.
Re: Whether this deal is connected to the rumor that an FF deal was made in October of 2015, and if the current news connects to those old rumors, Bloomberg describes the curent talks between Fox and Disney this way:
"The talks between Disney and Fox, which began more than two months ago, will unite two giants of the entertainment industry. . ."
So these talks are about Disney buying a stake in Fox assets, and have lasted only for a little more than two months.
The rumor going in the fall of 2015 was about some sort of swap of FF for X-Men rights, so that there could be an FF film in 2020. I consider those rumors still debunked, and tje studio denials back then proved true. This potential coming deal is a different and bigger thing, as @bralinator also explained above, and at a much later time.
I got to be honest with you, the Marvel portion is the only part that interests me.
Objectively, they didn’t completely debunk prior talks. Only that the current talks leading to this point occurred 2 months ago.
@Matt except that rumor 2 years ago were about a deal that supposedly already happened. It was ‘we’re hearing that a deal has been struck’, and there wasn’t one. That is why that rumor was debunked. It wasn’t debunked by this current news, but rather that the swap deal never materialized. The studios denied there was a deal, and that turned out to be true. That’s all.
The current rumors are much easier to believe as they are about ongoing talks (and it also adds weight that the sourcing is from places like Bloomberg News, rather than DenOfGeek, you know what I mean?)
I think that Disney has been looking at acquiring FOX for more than 2 months. I think this deal has been in the works for much longer and the negotiations tend to get leaked when they aren't going the way one side or the other wants them to go.
Again, I refer everyone to back when Sony was denying the rumors that they were going to loan Spider-Man to Marvel Studios / Disney?
These sorts of deals are negotiated and worked over long periods of time with rejected offers happening several times before a firm deal is in place, which is where we are now. Who really knows how long Disney has been putting out their feelers / interest? Probably ever since they bought Marvel or at least since they bought Star Wars.
We'll likely never know for sure, but hopefully someone will write a tell-all soon.
I think those rumors could have been trial balloons by whichever party was interested at the time. If you go back to the November 7, 2017 post by @TheOriginalGMan and read the article at the link on CNBC, it says something interesting:
The talks have taken place over the last few weeks and there is no certainty they will lead to a deal. The two sides are not currently talking at this very moment, but given the on again, off again nature of the talks, they could be revisited.
I think these kinds of discussions, offers, trial balloons, etc have been going on and off and on again for a while. Maybe not as far back as when @bamfbamf started this rumor / thread (where has he been the last 2 years?), but much longer than this current round of negotiations. It may have been Disney just trying to see how much money FOX would accept and then saying “nah. Too high.” then going away to wait and ask again in 6 months. Or FOX coming off a bomb FF movie and seeing if Disney would be willing to horse trade.
I’d be willing to believe that some of those discussions have involved the TV properties and what they’re worth, but an even swap for the FF? That Deal would be a stretch even if true. Disney would’ve never gone for it.
Still, i think I’d love to see a Disney version of the Fantastic Four, wouldn’t you? Maybe it could be part of this new Miles Morales Spider-Man universe from Sony? LOL
No longer a rumor. This can be good and bad in so many ways. I would like for both studios still be separate to some extent. Bring the FF to Marvel. And use the X-men as a major crossover event down the road. Leave Deadpool to himself and commit to more films like Logan. Phase Four indeed!
It actuall makes sense for Phase Four. With a number of actors leaving the MCU, they can start a transition to focus the next 22 movie arc with the FF. There’s a wealth of angles to be used. Not to mention if they use the X-Men in the MCU.
Hmm. We know the Avengers building was sold (as revealed in Homecoming). Could the FF be the new owners? How would production have known when they wrote the script over a year ago?! Cue X-Files theme.
I'm convinced this deal has been taking shape since before Disney broke ground on their 12-acre Pandora/Avatar attraction several years ago. Disney wouldn’t have sunk that much money into a theme park addition for a property (reportedly $500 million to build) if they didn’t intend to eventually own it outright themselves. At the time, they did not own the Avatar property.
Disney plays the long game. They had Indiana Jones and Star Wars attractions decades before buying Lucas out. This was after a long-time partnership between Disney and George Lucas that began in 1986 with the opening of Captain EO at the California park. For comparison to FOX, the Avatar attraction in the Animal Kingdom park was announced back in 2011. It just completed construction this year and SUDDENLY Jim Cameron is in the news announcing a bunch of sequels (for a movie that hardly anyone remembers).
In 2009, which is the year that Avatar was collecting a worldwide box-office gross of over $2.7 billion, Disney bought Marvel. My 'Disney-Insider' tells me, they immediately went to work trying to get back Spider-Man, X-Men and the Fantastic Four back in the fold. So after they bought Star Wars (Fox’s biggest money maker), Disney/Marvel Comics suddenly dialed back their support of those properties Fox had. The strategy was to cut off FOX's financial resources until they HAD to sell.
And here we are. However the deal came about, rest assured the scheme has been going on for much longer than "a couple of months".
@bralinator While i agree with the overall premise of Disney playing the long game, and eying the acquisition of Avatar as a possibility back when they committed to Pandora, a small correction about the timing you talked about: Cameron didn't suddenly announce a bunch of sequels to Avatar to coincide with the opening of Pandora. That helped return Avatar to the news, and remind people that it was a thing, but he and Fox inked a sequel deal soon after the success of the first one, and they upped the number of sequels back in 2013. I also know from a friend who went to work for Lightstorm a little before Pandora opened that Cameron has had people working and world building on Avatar for years and years now. They have done a tremendous amount of work on it, that ended up informing some of the designs in the Pandora attraction, but are more for the three (!) sequels they are supposed to be doing.
(Personally, the first Avatar was more Avatar than I needed, and I say that as a longtime fan of Cameron, but that is beside the point.)
I never even saw Avatar - so I’m not a fan either, but I am a fan of Cameron’s work. Strange I suppose. Yet if you look at those earlier two sequel announcements, we were supposed to have them coming in 2017 - and that was back when there were only 2 sequels planned. But now there seem to be 4 sequels, maybe, with the first coming next year. (?)
Who knows, who cares? My mentioning of Avatar sequel news probably only served to muddy the waters of the point I was making. Disney plays the long game. I think we both agree on that.
Comments
Why do you need another Super-Team? The MMU is already starting to feel a bit crowded.
Why can't they use the comic book origin? Today, shooting rockets into space is becoming an everyday occurrence. There's no mystery or romance. If the story is set during the beginnings of the cold war you have a motive for the launch and a reason for the hurried preparations. You could even explain away the college professor dating a student and including her little brother on the trip.
Rant over.
I think you could use the rocket into space bit. Maybe it's to decommission a Hammer satellite that was revealed to have (attempted) advanced weaponry to "assist" with protecting the world. Since it's already been established Hammer has wanted the government defense contract & has subpar tech, there'd be a tie in (plus maybe even a Sam Rockwell cameo).
There's really only one "super team" in the MCU right now. Sure you have the GotG, but they appear to be in deep space. The FF could do some space & some Earth based adventures.
I think there's a lot of missed opportunities if the FF, Doom, & crew are the generation before the Avengers.
Plus, I'd love a little nod by a Chris Evans Cap approaching Johnny Storm with "you seem familiar" (which works on 2 fronts if you remember the Human Torch at the Fair in First Avenger).
M
http://collider.com/fantastic-four-2-plans-simon-kinberg/#images
He still sounds like he is on the fence, but just because he doesn't exactly walk back his original comments doesn't mean he isn't keenly aware of the economics involved.
At this point it's not very likely to happen.
"21st Century Fox has been holding talks to sell most of the company to Disney: Sources"
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/11/06/21st-century-fox-has-been-holding-talks-to-sell-most-of-company-to-disney-sources.html
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-12-11/fox-deal-is-said-coming-within-days-giving-murdoch-disney-stake
j/k
I believe Disney is looking FAR past the Marvel properties on this one. Once this deal happens, Disney would also own the Avatar franchise (which is already part of Disney’s Animal Kingdom), as well as other IPs such as Alien (which Dark Horse would probably lose too). It could also finally mean the re-issue of the unaltered original Star Wars trilogy (FOX owns distribution rights to 'Episode IV').
Disney wants to start their own Netflix style streaming service, and acquiring the 20th century FOX library and IPs would go a LONG way towards making that a reality. Depending on your perspective, this is a VERY bad thing or a very good thing.
As it stands, Disney currently has an involvement in around 40% of all the films released in 2017. This would increase that percentage.
The rumor going in the fall of 2015 was about some sort of swap of FF for X-Men rights, so that there could be an FF film in 2020. I consider those rumors still debunked, and tje studio denials back then proved true. This potential coming deal is a different and bigger thing, as @bralinator also explained above, and at a much later time.
The rumor going in the fall of 2015 was about some sort of swap of FF for X-Men rights, so that there could be an FF film in 2020. I consider those rumors still debunked, and tje studio denials back then proved true. This potential coming deal is a different and bigger thing, as @bralinator also explained above, and at a much later time.
I got to be honest with you, the Marvel portion is the only part that interests me.
Objectively, they didn’t completely debunk prior talks. Only that the current talks leading to this point occurred 2 months ago.
The current rumors are much easier to believe as they are about ongoing talks (and it also adds weight that the sourcing is from places like Bloomberg News, rather than DenOfGeek, you know what I mean?)
Again, I refer everyone to back when Sony was denying the rumors that they were going to loan Spider-Man to Marvel Studios / Disney?
http://www.themovienetwork.com/article/sony-denies-rumors-about-considering-loaning-spiderman-marvel
These sorts of deals are negotiated and worked over long periods of time with rejected offers happening several times before a firm deal is in place, which is where we are now. Who really knows how long Disney has been putting out their feelers / interest? Probably ever since they bought Marvel or at least since they bought Star Wars.
We'll likely never know for sure, but hopefully someone will write a tell-all soon.
But the rumor that was the start of this thread two years ago, that FF rights had been swapped for X-Men rights in some unusual kind of deal? Bunk.
I’d be willing to believe that some of those discussions have involved the TV properties and what they’re worth, but an even swap for the FF? That Deal would be a stretch even if true. Disney would’ve never gone for it.
Still, i think I’d love to see a Disney version of the Fantastic Four, wouldn’t you? Maybe it could be part of this new Miles Morales Spider-Man universe from Sony? LOL
"Disney Acquires 21st Century Fox in Landmark Deal"
http://comicbook.com/marvel/2017/12/06/disney-fox-deal-marvel-xmen-star-wars/
Dr. Doom
Galactus
The Silver Surfer
The Skrulls
Kang the Conquerer
Annihilis
I am so excited with the potential of having a good Doctor Doom, I'm sure they will add Latveria and that will be cool.
Disney plays the long game. They had Indiana Jones and Star Wars attractions decades before buying Lucas out. This was after a long-time partnership between Disney and George Lucas that began in 1986 with the opening of Captain EO at the California park. For comparison to FOX, the Avatar attraction in the Animal Kingdom park was announced back in 2011. It just completed construction this year and SUDDENLY Jim Cameron is in the news announcing a bunch of sequels (for a movie that hardly anyone remembers).
In 2009, which is the year that Avatar was collecting a worldwide box-office gross of over $2.7 billion, Disney bought Marvel. My 'Disney-Insider' tells me, they immediately went to work trying to get back Spider-Man, X-Men and the Fantastic Four back in the fold. So after they bought Star Wars (Fox’s biggest money maker), Disney/Marvel Comics suddenly dialed back their support of those properties Fox had. The strategy was to cut off FOX's financial resources until they HAD to sell.
And here we are. However the deal came about, rest assured the scheme has been going on for much longer than "a couple of months".
(Personally, the first Avatar was more Avatar than I needed, and I say that as a longtime fan of Cameron, but that is beside the point.)
Who knows, who cares? My mentioning of Avatar sequel news probably only served to muddy the waters of the point I was making. Disney plays the long game. I think we both agree on that.