I have to admit, the Joker is one of the main reasons my interest is lukewarm (at best) on this. It's very superficial, but I just can't get past his look. I hope his characterization is generally accepted, but the grill & tats just pull me away from it.
Yeah, he appears less Charles Manson crazy and more Marilyn Manson crazy... You know, pretending. Too stylish, deliberate and self aware than I would envision the joker to be. Seems like a gangster / thug with a gimmick. Or just a disgruntled ex hot topic employee.
Speaking of The Joker, he feels designed by committee. He looks like a Juggalo - not a good look. The Joker shouldn't look like he member of the Insane Clown Posse fan club. And he's sporting a grill. The Joker should not appropriate culture, nor should he EVER have HIS OWN FAN ART tattooed on his body. That “Hahaha” is straight from the pages of comic book art. Unless the Joker lives in a meta universe where comic books of his antics exist, this shouldn't happen. Harley, on the other hand, was perfectly realized.
I'm an old prude; I don't care for Harley's tats either. If she lost those, I'd be more interested. Though, comments I've read make her character seems like it's all about her sex appeal with minimal depth. I'm hoping they at least make her seem like a powerful female.
I'm an old prude; I don't care for Harley's tats either. If she lost those, I'd be more interested. Though, comments I've read make her character seems like it's all about her sex appeal with minimal depth. I'm hoping they at least make her seem like a powerful female.
She has a really good fight scene that pretty much shows she can hold her own with "the boys". That and Deadshot's big moment of solo action were some of the high points of the movie for me.
While I know the various Suicide Squad comics have had different rosters for different reasons, one thing which bugs me about the film's premise is that Viola Davis' Amanda Waller very specifically says she wants to assemble of team of metas who can take down a meta, should the world ever face an evil Superman situation. So I'm watching this movie and thinking "Harley Quinn? Not a meta. Deadshot? Not a meta. Capt. Boomerang? Not a meta. Slipknot? Not a meta."
While I know the various Suicide Squad comics have had different rosters for different reasons, one thing which bugs me about the film's premise is that Viola Davis' Amanda Waller very specifically says she wants to assemble of team of metas who can take down a meta, should the world ever face an evil Superman situation. So I'm watching this movie and thinking "Harley Quinn? Not a meta. Deadshot? Not a meta. Capt. Boomerang? Not a meta. Slipknot? Not a meta."
...one thing which bugs me about the film's premise is that Viola Davis' Amanda Waller very specifically says she wants to assemble of team of metas who can take down a meta."
Yeah, Harley's gum-snapping, smart-mouthing, giant hammer-swinging skills probably wouldn't stand up for long against the true metas of the DC cinematic universe (such as it is).
Of course, we all know the DC movies are strung together with the thinnest spider-webs of logic and connectivity....so it almost goes without saying that Suicide Squad technically has a premise, but one that doesn't stand up under even a milligram of scrutiny.
From the article: "In the post-credits sting, Amanda Waller hands Bruce Wayne a top-secret file that she refers to as the 'crown jewels' detailing meta humans like The Flash and Aquaman - Wayne says he wants it because he's interested in making friends. But wait, hasn't he already got a digital version of this as seen in BvS: Dawn Of Justice? Is it that his inkjet's on the blink and he really wants to have a read of them in the bath?"
From the article: "In the post-credits sting, Amanda Waller hands Bruce Wayne a top-secret file that she refers to as the 'crown jewels' detailing meta humans like The Flash and Aquaman - Wayne says he wants it because he's interested in making friends. But wait, hasn't he already got a digital version of this as seen in BvS: Dawn Of Justice? Is it that his inkjet's on the blink and he really wants to have a read of them in the bath?"
He has whatever LUTHOR had on them.
I'm willing to put money down that whatever Waller has on them is a bit more detailed.
From the article: "In the post-credits sting, Amanda Waller hands Bruce Wayne a top-secret file that she refers to as the 'crown jewels' detailing meta humans like The Flash and Aquaman - Wayne says he wants it because he's interested in making friends. But wait, hasn't he already got a digital version of this as seen in BvS: Dawn Of Justice? Is it that his inkjet's on the blink and he really wants to have a read of them in the bath?"
He has whatever LUTHOR had on them.
I'm willing to put money down that whatever Waller has on them is a bit more detailed.
He's Batman. He couldn't have pieced together the info himself?
He's Batman. He couldn't have pieced together the info himself?
Waller figured out Batman was Bruce Wayne. In my book, she's a better detective (or to be more accurate, has better detectives working for her).
I remember in one of my books Batman admitted that Waller was one of the few people he was actually afraid of.
Does that mean Lex is a better detective as well?
I haven't seen the movie because it's not on Netflix yet, so I don't know the specifics. If Curry & Allen aren't mentioned, then I'd understand Batman getting a list of other metas to possibly bring into the Outsiders...I mean Justice League.
If Curry & Allen are mentioned & Batman needed Waller to do the detective work, then bad job on him.
I haven't seen the movie because it's not on Netflix yet, so I don't know the specifics. If Curry & Allen aren't mentioned, then I'd understand Batman getting a list of other metas to possibly bring into the Outsiders...I mean Justice League.
If Curry & Allen are mentioned & Batman needed Waller to do the detective work, then bad job on him.
Who's to say what Wayne's doing isn't part of his detective work?
"I've got what Lex had. Now let's see what Waller has and compare/contrast the two."
This is the guy, remember, who found a way to take down every single metahuman in the DCU. He didn't do that all by his lonesome.
I haven't seen the movie because it's not on Netflix yet, so I don't know the specifics. If Curry & Allen aren't mentioned, then I'd understand Batman getting a list of other metas to possibly bring into the Outsiders...I mean Justice League.
If Curry & Allen are mentioned & Batman needed Waller to do the detective work, then bad job on him.
Who's to say what Wayne's doing isn't part of his detective work?
"I've got what Lex had. Now let's see what Waller has and compare/contrast the two."
This is the guy, remember, who found a way to take down every single metahuman in the DCU. He didn't do that all by his lonesome.
I'd argue your second sentence clashes with your initial. As far as I know, Lex doesn't know what Batman stole. Waller now knows what Batman has & what his intent is.
I wouldn't necessarily say taking someone else's book report, attach it to my book report & run with it.
I don't recall seeing Batman collaborate with anyone else on his contingency plans when I read the JLA Secret Files issue.
To me? The most interesting thing about that file handed between Amanda/Bruce was the first character we see in it when opened, before Flash and Aquaman - is Enchantress. Is she going to be in JL?
To me? The most interesting thing about that file handed between Amanda/Bruce was the first character we see in it when opened, before Flash and Aquaman - is Enchantress. Is she going to be in JL?
Isn't she supposed to be in Justice League Dark, assuming that ever gets made?
As to how long she'd last against true metas? Well, we're in the fourth year of Injustice: Gods Among Us and she's one of the few still standing.
Hey, you gotta keep your star characters around if you wanna sell those books.
You have a point. DC publisher, Jim Lee considers Harley Quinn to be the 4th most important character in the DC universe.
"I refer to her as the fourth pillar in our publishing line, behind Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman," Jim Lee just told Vulture. Harley currently stars in four series — three eponymous ones and Suicide Squad. Only Batman and Superman have comparable numbers of monthly appearances, and Wonder Woman doesn’t come close, making Harley Quinn DC Comics’ most prominent (and bankable) female character.
I don't really care for Harley Quinn, but I do agree with Jim Lee to emphasize her as much as possible. She is wildly popular, particularly with female fans.
She may be wildly popular, but Lee's claim that Harley is "the fourth pillar of our publishing line" is almost childishly grandiose. Jim and Stan put the "Lee" in "hyperbole".
She’s popular for a lot of the same reasons Deadpool is popular—cartoon violence, irreverent humor, etc.—but I think she appeals to a broader audience than Deadpool.
The original Harley as she appeared in B:TAS was kind of a male power fantasy figure—the beautiful, funny, dangerous (but vulnerable) woman utterly devoted to her man no matter how badly he treats her. But in the second series, they broke her away from that, and made her and Ivy a Thelma-and-Louise type of pairing that women could relate to and even cheer for in some ways—almost a 180º character turn (but with the occasional relapse). DC basically followed that same character arc in the comics. That gave the character a whole new, quite different audience to go along with the already huge number of fans she’d built with the cartoon. With Harley, DC gets to have its cake and eat it too.
In a lot of ways Harley is very much like Batman, in that she is a malleable character that can be used effectively in a wide variety of tones. She can run the gamut from cute, silly clown (a là Tiny Titans) to homicidal eye candy (a là the Arkham video games) without missing a beat. She is as appealing to women as she is to men. And despite a wide variety of costumes (most of which I hate), she is instantly recognizable simply by her color scheme and a few well-placed diamonds (her cosplay potential shouldn’t be overlooked).
While it might be hyperbole to say she’s DC’s fourth pillar (being as how DC really only has three pillars), I don’t think it’s all that outrageous a claim. The only other character DC has that can compete with her for that spot at the moment is the Flash. While I hate what they’ve done to the character the past few years, it is what it is, and it’s paid off for DC.
Her books sell huge. There was a good while during the New 52 where DC could only move comics that had the names Harley Quinn, Batman, or Geoff Johns on the covers.
On another note: has anyone here listened to Kevin Smith's podcast review of Suicide Squad? He bent over backward praising it - though he didn't come across as all that genuine to me.
While it might be hyperbole to say she’s DC’s fourth pillar (being as how DC really only has three pillars), I don’t think it’s all that outrageous a claim. The only other character DC has that can compete with her for that spot at the moment is the Flash. While I hate what they’ve done to the character the past few years, it is what it is, and it’s paid off for DC.
Not be sexist here, but DC has rarely even had "three pillars". Most of the time it's only had two legs to stand on. I think Harley is pretty close to being to the "third pillar" of DC publishing.
While it might be hyperbole to say she’s DC’s fourth pillar (being as how DC really only has three pillars), I don’t think it’s all that outrageous a claim. The only other character DC has that can compete with her for that spot at the moment is the Flash. While I hate what they’ve done to the character the past few years, it is what it is, and it’s paid off for DC.
Not be sexist here, but DC has rarely even had "three pillars". Most of the time it's only had two legs to stand on. I think Harley is pretty close to being to the "third pillar" of DC publishing.
Oh, I agree with you. The Wonder Woman pillar is definitely a shaky one, but it’s one DC has been constantly trying to firm up since the ’70s. For me the character is a pillar in terms of recognition and symbolism more than in terms of financial success—much like Captain America was for Marvel from the Silver Age on. Perhaps the upcoming movie will be the the cement that finally gives Wonder Woman the strong foundation DC has been looking to establish, just as the Captain America and Avengers movies (and the Ed Brubaker comic series) seem to have done for Cap.
Comments
Yeah, I know. But it still bugs me.
Of course, we all know the DC movies are strung together with the thinnest spider-webs of logic and connectivity....so it almost goes without saying that Suicide Squad technically has a premise, but one that doesn't stand up under even a milligram of scrutiny.
As to how long she'd last against true metas? Well, we're in the fourth year of Injustice: Gods Among Us and she's one of the few still standing.
From the article: "In the post-credits sting, Amanda Waller hands Bruce Wayne a top-secret file that she refers to as the 'crown jewels' detailing meta humans like The Flash and Aquaman - Wayne says he wants it because he's interested in making friends. But wait, hasn't he already got a digital version of this as seen in BvS: Dawn Of Justice? Is it that his inkjet's on the blink and he really wants to have a read of them in the bath?"
I'm willing to put money down that whatever Waller has on them is a bit more detailed.
I remember in one of my books Batman admitted that Waller was one of the few people he was actually afraid of.
I haven't seen the movie because it's not on Netflix yet, so I don't know the specifics. If Curry & Allen aren't mentioned, then I'd understand Batman getting a list of other metas to possibly bring into the Outsiders...I mean Justice League.
If Curry & Allen are mentioned & Batman needed Waller to do the detective work, then bad job on him.
"I've got what Lex had. Now let's see what Waller has and compare/contrast the two."
This is the guy, remember, who found a way to take down every single metahuman in the DCU. He didn't do that all by his lonesome.
I wouldn't necessarily say taking someone else's book report, attach it to my book report & run with it.
I don't recall seeing Batman collaborate with anyone else on his contingency plans when I read the JLA Secret Files issue.
The original Harley as she appeared in B:TAS was kind of a male power fantasy figure—the beautiful, funny, dangerous (but vulnerable) woman utterly devoted to her man no matter how badly he treats her. But in the second series, they broke her away from that, and made her and Ivy a Thelma-and-Louise type of pairing that women could relate to and even cheer for in some ways—almost a 180º character turn (but with the occasional relapse). DC basically followed that same character arc in the comics. That gave the character a whole new, quite different audience to go along with the already huge number of fans she’d built with the cartoon. With Harley, DC gets to have its cake and eat it too.
In a lot of ways Harley is very much like Batman, in that she is a malleable character that can be used effectively in a wide variety of tones. She can run the gamut from cute, silly clown (a là Tiny Titans) to homicidal eye candy (a là the Arkham video games) without missing a beat. She is as appealing to women as she is to men. And despite a wide variety of costumes (most of which I hate), she is instantly recognizable simply by her color scheme and a few well-placed diamonds (her cosplay potential shouldn’t be overlooked).
While it might be hyperbole to say she’s DC’s fourth pillar (being as how DC really only has three pillars), I don’t think it’s all that outrageous a claim. The only other character DC has that can compete with her for that spot at the moment is the Flash. While I hate what they’ve done to the character the past few years, it is what it is, and it’s paid off for DC.
On another note: has anyone here listened to Kevin Smith's podcast review of Suicide Squad? He bent over backward praising it - though he didn't come across as all that genuine to me.